The most fundamental aspect of the human species is our interdependence on one another,

and out of that can develop a healthy independence.

The existential has had it all wrong. We're born alone and die alone.

Who was ever born alone?

There's a way to think about the individual going through life, having relationships,

as opposed to we are inherent relational,

and out of that comes the ability to be independent.

What a truth that is that we are literally born in interdependence.

It seems to me it's a sort of yin and yang thing, right, where it's the duality.

We must develop a self, we must develop a sense of who we are, but not be too focused on it, but not be beating ourselves up either, but a sense of that, and then a sense of others as well.

There's a dynamic equilibrium to be aimed at in healthy relationships. Welcome back, everybody. I'm your host, Greg McEwen, and today I have a guest. I'm so pleased to be

having a conversation with. This is Bill Doherty. He's had the most remarkable life. He's going to

correct me where I get this wrong, but I understand, again, life in the ministry,

shifted from that into family social work, felt an inflection point, a transition point,

and then in 2016 put his significant competence and capability into starting Braver Angels, which is an institution

really now that is trying to foster the depolarization of conversation, and not in some general way, but by bringing

together reds and blues, as they're referred to in Braver Angels, and now other groups as well,

but in person, face-to-face, not screaming at each other on social media, not assuming the worst about each other,

but getting trained in how to have these conversations.

It's so vital because I'm not sure we ever really had these skills in abundance at any point,

but it's certainly true that whatever we had has been strained through a series of different mechanisms,

not least of all through social media.

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