#365 Taxes: An American History w/ Vanessa S. Williamson

The Road to Now

Benjamin Sawyer

Society & Culture, History

4.8 • 628 Ratings

🗓️ 6 April 2026

⏱️ 69 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Did you know that the Boston Tea Party was sparked by a corporate tax cut? Or that during the explosive post-WWII economic boom, the highest tax bracket in the US was about 90%? Or that the more democratic a country is, the more taxes its citizens tend to pay?

In this episode, Vanessa S. Williamson joins us for a conversation about her new book, The Price of Democracy: The Revolutionary Power of Taxation in American History (Basic Books, 2025), the misunderstandings that shape both liberal and conservative attitudes toward tax policy, and the reasons she thinks that taxation and democracy are inseparable in US history.

Dr. Vanessa S. Williamson is Senior Fellow in Governance Studies at the Brookings Institute and Senior Fellow at the Urban-Brookings Tax Policy Center.

This episode was edited by Gary Fletcher.

Transcript

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0:00.0	I'm Ben Sawyer and this is the road to now. I never thought I would say this before, but today the topic is taxes and I could not be more excited about it. If you are dreading this tax season, as many of us are, I guarantee you that if you listen to this episode and you follow the argument,
0:24.3	you're going to feel a little bit better about it. Our guest is Vanessa S. Williamson. She is senior
0:30.2	fellow in governance studies at the Brookings Institute and senior fellow at the Urban Brookings Tax Policy
0:35.8	Center. She has just put out a book, The Price of Democracy,
0:39.7	the Revolutionary Power of Taxation in American History. I wish every American would read this book.
0:45.5	We don't know the history of taxation as a country and it has led us to a lot of wrong conclusions
0:51.6	and just a lot of wrong thinking. And one of the things I love here
0:56.4	is Vanessa takes on the misconceptions that both the kind of mainstream liberal and
1:02.6	mainstream conservative have about taxation. Whatever your take on taxes is right now,
1:08.5	you're going to walk away a bit wiser. I mean, just to start off the
1:14.0	Boston Tea Party, which for God's sakes, there's a truck commercial. We spilled the tea and now buy a
1:20.2	truck. But our conceptions of this event are so off. And as she says, it wasn't a rebellion against taxes. It was actually a rebellion
1:29.9	against a corporate tax cut. Dang. And we're going to follow this argument through up until
1:36.2	current events. So I hope you guys enjoy this and I hope you walk away a little wiser. I
1:41.5	certainly thought this book was so incredible, and I hope you
1:45.3	guys will check it out. Link to buy that book is in the episode description. In other news,
1:51.0	Bob's book is out, America's Founding Sun. You guys check that book out if you haven't already.
1:55.9	He's also doing some bookstore events and all of that. So you can check that out on Bob's Instagram. That's at
2:01.9	Bob Crawford Bass. And the Avert Brothers are on tour with Mike Patton and the album is fantastic.
2:08.5	Check out their dates, Avertbrothers.com. Man, they're coming to Nashville and I'm going to
2:14.3	see him and I'm excited about it. So check them out. And if you want to
2:17.9	see me, you can come see me do stand-up comedy. I'm frequently at Zanis Nashville, my comedy game
	...

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