You're listening to the business-made simple podcast with Donald Miller and Dr. JJ Peterson.

Hey everybody, this is Dr. JJ Peterson and we are living in a new job market and yet we're

still relying on old ways of hiring and creating culture and rules and policy.

Today's guest is Aaron Meier, co-author of No Rules Rules. Netflix and the Culture of Reinvention

and Aaron has honed in on exactly how Netflix grew to become one of the largest global

brands in history by throwing rules out the window and she gives you some practical tips on how

you can create a culture and environment that attracts and keeps top talent and allows your

business to grow in this new environment and job market. Aaron, thanks so much for being with us

today. So nice to be here, JJ. I loved your book and I know that so many of our listeners

are going to love this book if they haven't already picked it up. But as I was kind of going through

your book and listening to interviews with you, I got so excited about all of the things that

were happening at Netflix, right? And I think even for myself, I immediately wanted to start applying

all of these rules. There's really no vacation policy. You can take whatever you want and there's

this mindset of high performance and high talent and a lot of freedom. And I love all of the sound

behind that. And I think all of our listeners would get really excited and go, yes, this is who

we're going to be. And then I kind of stepped back for a second and went before I dive into like,

let's give everybody free vacation. Why? What led Netflix to really start making these decisions

of the No Rules that rules their culture? So I conducted 200 interviews with Netflix

employees as I was getting ready to write this book, which I wrote with the founder of Netflix

with Reed Hastings. And my biggest realization is that really most organizations today, despite

talking a lot about innovation and about wanting to be more agile, they're really they're obsessed

still with error prevention and consistency, which was this hangover from the industrial era,

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