252: Ronald Rolheiser: How to Grow Old Without Growing Bitter

No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp

Lee Camp

Philosophy, Society & Culture, Religion & Spirituality

4.8 • 555 Ratings

🗓️ 9 March 2026

⏱️ 53 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

What if the final chapter of your life could become your greatest gift? In this deeply wise conversation, Father Ronald Rolheiser joins Lee C. Camp to explore the spiritual invitation of aging. Drawing from his latest book ⁠Insane for the Light: A Spirituality for Our Wisdom Years⁠, Rolheiser reflects on loneliness, diminishment, forgiveness, and what it means to give not only our lives—but our deaths—away. This episode offers profound wisdom for anyone seeking authentic human flourishing in the final seasons of life. Key Ideas: Give Your Death Away The final stage of life invites us to offer our vulnerability and diminishment as a gift, leaving behind a spirit of peace rather than resentment. Choose Your Old Fool Aging makes us all “old fools”—but we can become pathetic, angry, or holy, depending on whether we cling, resent, or receive with grace. Grieve So You Don’t Grow Bitter Unhealed wounds harden into anger over time, but grieving what cannot be undone allows the soul to mellow. Live from the “Above Mind” Jesus’ call to metanoia invites us out of defensive paranoia into open-handed trust, courage, and love. Practice Gratitude and Forgiveness In the wisdom years, the spiritual vocabulary simplifies. Two words remain: gratitude and forgiveness.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠Show Notes, Resources and Transcript⁠⁠ for abridged episode with Ronald Rolheiser⁠⁠⁠ Thank you to our sponsors: Boll and Branch: Get 20% off plus free shipping by visiting ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BollAndBranch.com/NSE⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join NSE+⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@nosmallendeavor⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@leeccamp ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	I'm Lee C. Camp. This is no small endeavor, exploring what it means to live a good life.
0:09.4	You get to be my age in late 70s. There's only two spiritual words you need left, gratitude and forgiveness.
0:17.5	That's Roman Catholic priest and spiritual theologian Father Ronald Rollheiser, discussing his latest book,
0:23.6	Insane for the Light, a spirituality for our wisdom ears.
0:28.6	You can't undo the past.
0:31.6	You can't undo the fact your mother loved your sister better than you.
0:35.6	But you can grieve it, then it won't get bitter. You won't get angry.
0:39.9	We discuss aging, the art of letting go, and the joy possible in the final chapters of a life
0:46.9	well-lived. The best wines have to be aged in cracked old barrels. That mellows the soul. All coming right up.
0:59.6	Hey friends, Lee Camp here. We all need advice, but it's not always clear who to ask, even in
1:05.7	2026, which is why I recommend checking out how to the longstanding advice show and 2026 Amby Award nominated Best Personal Growth Podcast.
1:16.9	No Small Endeavor was also just up for the very same award in that category.
1:20.6	So you know how to must be a great companion to our show.
1:23.4	More than that, How To is back with new episodes and a new host with award-winning journalist Mike Peska.
1:29.6	Each week, Mike tackles a listener question ranging from travel to finance to relationships and beyond
1:35.7	with help from world-class experts who actually know what they are talking about.
1:40.0	Think of it as eavesdropping on someone else's therapy session without a copay or awkward silence.
1:46.0	No questions too big or too specific, like how to protect the elderly from scammers,
1:51.7	or how to give to a good cause and make it count and even how to make a how to podcast.
1:58.5	You've got questions.
1:59.7	They will find some answers. So follow how to
2:02.9	with Mike Peska on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen. I'm Lee C. Camp. This is no
	...

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