Welcome to the Not Old Better

show is author John Butman. John John Butman is an American writer and has

written several books under his own name and collaborated on more than 30 other

titles including New York Times and Boston Globe bestsellers, and Economist Award winners.

John Butman's latest book, along with co-author Simon Target, New World Incorporated The Making of America by England's Merchant Adventures, is part

history book and part swashbuckling tale about the Making of America.

The story of the Making of America actually begins in England in the mid-1500s, 70 years before

the Mayflower, set out to brave the Westerly Gales and cross the Atlantic.

That of course is our guest today, author John Buteman.

Please join me in welcoming to the not old better show via internet telephone John

butman welcome to the show. Thank you Paul it's great to be with you I

really I have to tell you I really enjoyed your your new book neworporated, and I want to talk about that, but I want to talk about this first question that I have,

kind of the founding of America from your book and this real dichotomy almost.

We learn in grade school about the colonization,

about the pilgrims, about religious freedom.

You know, I found this quote that you used from John Winthrop

about building a city on the hill

really it's not so much about that it's more about kind of failed business efforts

investment capital gold silver, all of that.

Yes, it's so fascinating to me that we live with this myth of the pilgrims that we all learn in grade school and that we kind

of love and we sort of accept without really looking at it very hard, you know?

And the idea is that the pilgrims sailed over in 1620 and they had one ship and they were all alone

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