Book your ticket to happiness that to a thing. I'm John Bachelors with Anthony Ruggiero, Senior Fellow Foundation for the Defense of Democracy,

former director of the North Korean desk at the National Security Council, identifying the promotion of North Korea

is fragmented and badly abused people to Moscow's's delight, Vladimir Putin may visit.

Young, may open its arms to Russian tourists.

Unknown, however, what is to be done?

Anthony, sanctions were in place in 2018 and then.

And what now for sanctions, given the sanctions on Ukraine, given the sanctions on Russia, given the sanctions in all directions.

What can sanctions do for North Korea?

Well we know that Kim responds to sanctions. The only thing he's really asked for are, you know,

reduction in military exercises and sanctions relief during negotiations. You know, I found it interesting you know we had these reports now that the

Japanese prime minister is thinking about you know meeting with Kim and and you know we

have we get all these suggestions by people, most of whom are now North Korea experts

suggesting, oh, we should do, you know, a limited deal with North Korea, like an ICBM deal,

you know, my response, besides saying that we've done that many, many times. my leverage over North Korea because our sanctions program is so atrophy.

We don't go after the most important parts of it.

So then you're going into negotiation with North Korea with zero leverage and then

what is really left? are we going to agree to remove our

troops from South Korea and Japan and elsewhere like relieving sanctions that are

not hurting Kim is not something that the North Koreans are going to say,

oh yeah, you know, we're going to give up our nuclear weapons and you give us these token sanctions relief.

That's just not how negotiations work.

Secondary sanctions seem to put fear in those who own oil

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