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I'm John Boucher. This is the new John Boucher Show at CBS Audio Network. I'm very pleased to be speaking with Henry Tricks, who is in Great Britain.

He works for the Economist magazine. He has helped me understand the generations of businessmen, business women, people who make decisions for private corporations, and politics, and epochs.

And right now we're back to the 21st century. Henry Atlanta is an example of activism. That's the word that's used, generally speaking, of CEOs.

Even entering into a conversation in Zoom because it is the pandemic. During the master's golf tournament weekend to discuss a letter that was eventually published, seen as nonpartisan in support of voting rights.

However, I mention that only because it's one example of CEOs acting corporate CEOs acting in political atmospheres. You, at Economist, also mentioned Jamie Dimon, who speaks out on a number of political matters and has been prominent really for a long time but certainly since the Great Recession of 2009-2010 when he was prominently in conversation with then President Barack Obama.

And also you mentioned the business roundtable, making political observations all the time, although it's put in terms of where's the market going? Are those positive examples of CEOs and just that encourage this transformation again? It's not just shareholders. It's also the atmosphere of the company.

I don't think that we see this as uniformly positive. Let me be very clear here that that the Economist has no doubt about the importance of supporting voting rights.

And so when we saw what was being done both in Georgia and across various states in America, there was certainly a sense that it's important to ensure that there is easy access to voting and that voting rights are respected.

The worry here is really one of concentration of power. It's the fact that business leaders are unelected. They do tend to serve their own interests.

And they pretty much always lobbying for their own advantage. So really the risk is that by becoming too involved in politics, they not only undermine their own businesses because their concentration is directed towards other causes.

But also potentially undermine the political process. We think that it's really up to politicians to be regulating businesses or it's for politicians to be underpinning the market so that businesses operate fairly.

And we're worried that when businesses get too involved in politics, that it exchange becomes somewhat upside down.

And so what we've seen, I suppose, over the course of the last 15 or 20 years, especially in the last five years, is this move towards CEO activism, which is stretched from very social issues to issues that are around gender, race, and ultimately,

politics. I think it was really the entry of Donald Trump into the presidency that kickstarted the politically-day-to-go CEOs.

You'll all remember at the very beginning of 2017, after Mr. Trump imposed a ban on immigration from some Muslim countries.

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