Welcome to the Making Sense podcast. This is Sam Harris. Just a note to say that if

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Okay. I am here with Paul Bloom. Paul, thanks for joining me. Hey Sam, thanks for having me.

So just a little preamble to set up this conversation. I have been thinking of late that I've been

kind of getting boxed in my normal podcast format. I mean, I'm often having conversations with people

where they've written a book very likely. And I've taken, rather often, taken the time to read it.

And this may be the one conversation I ever have with them. And so it really has to be

focused on their topic and fairly buttoned up and exhaustive. And it doesn't really allow me,

in most cases, to just kind of wander around and hit topics of interest and be a little more

freeform and conversational. And so I was thinking of starting a new track in the podcast

where I can be more topical and kind of of the moment and experimental and talk about work and

progress and all the rest. And I was thinking about who I could do that with. And you were the

first person to come to mind. And so as you know, I reached out to you and here you are. So thank

you for agreeing to do this. Well, I was I was really thrilled to be invited to do this. I

have always felt that our conversations go very well. And I think it's because you and I had a

certain sweet spot where we agree and disagree in the right measure, making our conversations

sort of productive, but not as constantly saying to one another, oh, you're right, you know, you're

...