Hi everyone, it's Tom here. Once again, having forgotten to record the intro that Clay and

Sarah have asked me to, so I'm doing on my phone and hopefully the sound is okay, but

apologies for that. Now, as listeners will know, we at Outrage and Optimism have recently

joined TED's Audio Collective and we are super happy to be associated with TED and the

wonderful work that they do and you should check out all of the other TED Audio Collective

podcasts. There are so many events we'll ever get your podcasts from. Over the last few

years, Kristiana and I have enjoyed a very close working relationship with TED Countdown,

something that we helped launch a few years ago and all of the incredible work going on to

shift the conversation on climate change and that has been very aligned with everything

that we have done at Outrage and Optimism. Earlier this year, Countdown ran what's called

a dilemma series in New York and the short episode that follows is the result of a conversation

that took place there between myself and Professor James Dyke, an academic, a writer and author

and associate professor of Earth System Science and Assistant Director of the Global Systems

Institute at the University of Exeter. Now, James is a good friend and he is also someone

who is skeptical that we are going to be able to keep global heating to 1.5 degrees, but

he is somebody that I've always enjoyed talking to because the two of us can come at that

from different perspectives and find creative ways to move forward. The subject overall

of the dilemma series was focused on the question, is there a role for carbon credits in the

transition to a fair net zero future, which as many of you will know has the potential

to be incredibly divisive in the climate community. The idea behind the dilemma series overall

was to look at some of the knots in the climate change space like carbon credits where diverging

positions mean that momentum is stalled as we struggle to collaborate with people who

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