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People I (Mostly) Admire

18. Robert Sapolsky: “I Don’t Think We Have Any Free Will Whatsoever.”

People I (Mostly) Admire

Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher

Society & Culture

4.61.9K Ratings

🗓️ 6 March 2021

⏱️ 42 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

He’s one of the world’s leading neuroscientists, with a focus on the physiological effects of stress. (For years, he spent his summers in Kenya, alone except for the baboons he was observing.) Steve asks Robert why we value human life over animals, why he’s lost faith in the criminal-justice system, and how to look casual when you’re about to blow-dart a very large and potentially unhappy primate.

Transcript

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0:00.0

My guest today, Robert Sapolsky, may know more about baboons in the wild than anyone

0:10.2

else on the planet.

0:11.7

On top of that, he's a leading neuroscientist who's made breakthrough discoveries on stress

0:15.5

and gene therapy.

0:16.5

He also devils in philosophy, arguing that free will is nothing but an illusion.

0:21.8

On top of all that, he's found the time to write a half dozen best-selling and critically

0:25.9

acclaimed books.

0:28.4

Welcome to People I Mostly Admire, with Steve Levitt.

0:33.7

This will be my first time talking to Robert Sapolsky, and I'm really curious to see what

0:37.8

it's like.

0:38.8

I've read every one of his books so in an odd way he feels like a friend, even though

0:43.3

I've never met him or even heard his voice.

0:46.2

In pictures he's got a big white beard and long curly hair that would make Santa Claus

0:50.6

jealous, which has led me to make all sorts of assumptions about how he'll speak and

0:55.3

even about his personality.

0:57.0

We shall see if looks are deceiving.

1:00.0

Now the two topics I want to cover for sure today are stress in humans, and that's a topic

1:04.8

in which he's an expert and I am absolutely not an expert in violence where we both might

1:11.3

have legitimate claims to be experts, although we've approached the issue from opposite perspectives.

1:17.0

I suspect those two parts of the conversation will be very different.

1:21.5

But before we hit those topics, I want to hear about the baboons.

1:28.5

Robert, it's so good to meet you.

...

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