We are publicly shaming people at earlier ages and we don't know sociologically.

What happens to kids who worry about that now at the age of 12?

What do they become mentally at age 25 and 30 and what do they like as managers and leaders?

I don't know.

It's Professor Todd Cashdon, ladies and gentlemen, and I believe I found a kindred spirit. I suppose I often

do, that's part of my job, isn't it, to connect with people? But Todd is a man after my own heart

with his interest in the gray zone between psychological,

philosophical and political discourse at the moment.

That's what I like, the gray zone, the bits between the centrist areas, they're looking at both sides of things.

So who is Professor Todd Kachton?

Well, he's a professor, obviously, of psychology at the George Mason University, where he is also the director for the well-being lab.

You can look that stuff up, but Todd has also written some super popular and acclaimed books,

including The Upside to Your Dark, and the power of negative emotion.

I like that stuff because I always feel that we're becoming a bit bland in our pursuit of

eternal happiness, this idea that any suffering at all is indicative of a disorder or something wrong in our lives

when really we need some suffering for so many reasons such as building a stronger defense mechanism or just art, creative expression,

art and rebellion, which is the topic of Todd's latest book, The Art of Insubordination.

Todd's writing reminds me of my former guest professor Paul Bloom,

so if you enjoy this episode do check that one out too.

I don't know when that was, it was like 50 or 100 episodes ago, but that was out too. I don't know when that was it was like 50 or 100 episodes of

go but that was really good but Todd and I discussed today in this also really

good episode why rebellion is important as a counter to group think. We need groups, we need to get along and form

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