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Thank you. one thing at drift.com slash DC. All right, we're back with another episode of Seeking Wisdom.

This is going to be an uncomfortable episode because I am a fanboy of the two people that we have as guests here.

They're going to feel like they're rock stars.

And I'm a young teenage fan boy right here.

And so I want to welcome Colin and Bill, authors of Working Backwards.

And if you listen to this podcast, you know I've been singing the praises of this book.

I've been waiting for this book for a very long time. And so welcome to the show, guys know I've been singing the praises of this book. I've been waiting for this book

for a very long time. And so welcome to the show, guys. Oh, thank you for inviting us. Thanks for

having us. We're excited. So before I introduce you formally, Bo, to the show with your backgrounds,

is there any coincidence with the timing of this book and Bezos's retirement.

Oh, absolutely. We were discussing with him about when he should change his role for the last couple of years. And he was a little reluctant on the date, but eventually he agreed that it

needed to correspond with our book release. Yeah, to celebrate your book. I just thought it was

funny because for so many years, I have been trying to scour and piece together different legends of how Amazon worked internally and nothing had come out. And it was very hard to find information. And then all of a sudden, Bezos announcer has moved to executive chair. Your book comes out. wilkie's on lots of podcasts i'm like what's

going like everything's coming out all of a sudden obviously coincidences but i thought it was it was funny

so i'm just going to formally introduce both of you so the audience knows first is colin brier

and so colin joined amazon and i'm reading this which i usually don't, but Amazon in 1998 and four years

after its founding, spent 12 years as part of Amazon's senior leadership team, and was famously

known as Bezos's Shadow, aka Jeff Shadow, which we'll get into, and ran many different things

including IMDB, which I was a huge fan of IMDB for many, many years, still am.

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