This is Jonathan Peugeot. Welcome to the symbolic world. So hello everybody. I'm here with Stephen, who is better known as Rationality Rules.

Rationality Rules is a very successful YouTube channel that takes on questions of debunking different spurious arguments about

the existence of God and other philosophical questions taken from the point of view rationality

and also scientific method and all those kinds of approaches.

And so until recently, I felt like I'd seen some of Stephen's videos and I felt like if we had had a conversation, we'd just be talking past each other.

And so recently I saw him take up the question of Brett Weinstein's idea of metaphorical truth.

And I heard him speaking about it in somewhat positive terms, at least in somewhat positive terms.

And so I thought this could be an interesting place for us to connect and at least have a little bit of common ground out of which we can build

an honest and an honest discussion about, you know, how far this can go, what are the limits of it

and what it means for our different positions. So, so Stephen, thanks for coming along. I really appreciate

yesterday. I just want to tell everybody yesterday we had this discussion and, Stephen, thanks for coming along. I really appreciate yesterday. I just want to tell everybody yesterday we had this discussion.

And then we had some technical difficulties at the beginning.

And then after that, I forgot to record it.

And so I'm still annoyed about that.

But hopefully there'll be enough of the kind of raw intensity of our discussion yesterday left over today not too much we didn't

like have a fight or anything but we like we went into it and oh metaphorical fight right

yeah exactly all right Steven so maybe you can you can tell us a little bit about uh how you see

brett Weinstein's position in terms of metaphorical truth, and then I can,

then we can just go on from there. I don't think we'll have a problem having a conversation.

Yeah, sure thing. As you said, we're going to be traversing some of the same ground as we did yesterday,

and because of that fact, we're going to be able to do it in a more precise manner. I think it was

really fruitful. And to everybody listening, I know you're, I assume you are as well, but I'm really

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