Welcome to the Making Sense Podcast. This is Sam Harris. Just a note to say that if you're

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Well today I'm speaking with Ian Bremer, and it's important to know that we recorded this

interview before Trump's recent meeting with Putin. We talk about Trump a little bit here.

Not much would change about the conversation, but it's just good to understand why we are

apparently oblivious to the recent news from Helsinki. The news that seems to my eye at least

to be every bit as alarming as the alarmists say it is, though unsurprising. It is of course no

surprise that Trump is sufficiently incompetent and so easily manipulated by his own narcissism

and self-interest that he could glad hand a tyrant who kills and jails journalists in his own

political opponents and take his side in a controversy that is in fact no controversy

against the unanimous understanding of the intelligence communities of the United States.

And we should note that serious people are using the word treason to describe this.

I don't think Ian Bremer today's guest would be one of them. He would be slow to make that

accusation, but it'll be very interesting to see if this is yet another thermonuclear scandal

that Trump manages to weather or if it actually matters in the end. It really does seem that for 40%

of the American population nothing he can do or say matters. There's no level of incoherency,

no level of conflict of interest, no ethical impropriety, nothing that can matter. It's amazing.

...