We have to do this complicated thing of stopping and building at the same time of saying no and proposing the yes.

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start making sense from the nation magazine and Jacob and radio.

There were many crises, states of crises that predated Trump, right? So even if every single defensive battle was won and we know that that is not happening and that it can't happen, there will be wins, there will be losses.

But even if in some amazing world every defensive victory was won, we would still be standing on the ground that where we were before we had Trump and that was the ground that produced Trump and that was not safe, right?

And that was the ground in which social movements like Black Lives Matters were surging and the climate justice movement was surging because we're out of time on that front.

So we somehow need it to fight defense and offense at the same time. We need to end up somewhere that is different and better than where we were before Trump.

It's basically like the movies that devil's advocate with counter-reves and Al Pacino where it ends and you're like, yeah, he won and then Al Pacino shows up with a devil again.

Here I am. Let's start it all over again.

Am I going to watch that movie every time it's on TBS?

I was like a Google, Google that movie right now.

I think I may have seen the movie.

Just the idea of the movie is that it's like this battle with the devil and at the end counter-reves is very like I won.

Whoa. And then the devil shows up at the very end of the movie implying like we're going to do this all again.

So I'm saying that like if we to sort of support what you're saying, if we defeat Trump at every turn, we still have the South Side of Chicago, the West Side of Chicago, we still have the Bronx, we still have all these neighborhoods, we still have Appalachia, we still have poverty in the South.

There's all these things that like you said produced him. So it would just be the next reality show TV game show host to be president.

Or worse, right? Because I mean as bad as Trump is, I do believe there's worse than Trump.

And this is why I think it's particularly worrying. And I think one of the threads that created Trump is this idea that billionaires are going to save us, right?

That we can outsource the world's problems to benevolent billionaires who who because they made a whole lot of money in one area, you know, our some sort of magical creatures who automatically know how to fix everything like take Bill Gates, you know, he seemed new a lot about creating a quasi software monopoly.

I will give him that, you know, but why he should have the power he has over the US school system because he has thrown so much money as a philanthropist at US school.

So to me, he's completely changed education in this country. He is a massive influence in healthcare internationally. He's more powerful than the world health organization.

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