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Talk Easy with Sam Fragoso

Writer Ocean Vuong’s Vision of the Future

Talk Easy with Sam Fragoso

Lemonada Media

Society & Culture, Film Interviews, Tv & Film

4.81.2K Ratings

🗓️ 1 June 2025

⏱️ 93 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Since his bestselling novel On Earth We’re Briefly Gorgeous debuted in 2019, Ocean Vuong has become one of the most beloved writers of his generation. He first sat with Sam in 2021 amid the pandemic.

Today, Vuong returns to discuss the personal history within his latest novel, The Emperor of Gladness—a piece of fiction that draws from the contours of his own coming-of-age in East Hartford, Connecticut (5:43). We begin with the class dynamics at the heart of the book (9:27), the surrogate family he found working at Boston Market (21:22), and his formative college years in New York City (28:18).

On the back half, we walk through how Ocean’s work continues to honor the memory of his late mother (36:48), the devastating impact of the opioid crisis (41:40), and his own journey to sobriety (45:03). To close, Vuong reflects on the childlike wonder behind his poem “Dear Sara” from Time Is a Mother (1:04:52), why he still loves teaching creative writing (1:18:30), and how all of these experiences deliver him back to the page, each and every day (1:26:00).

Watch our conversation on YouTube. Thoughts or future guest ideas? Email us at [email protected].

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Transcript

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0:00.0

Lemonada

0:02.0

Lemonada

0:04.0

This is Talk Easy. I'm San Francisco. Welcome to the show.

0:41.8

Today, writer and professor, Ocean Vong.

0:46.5

Vong first joined us around the publication of his debut novel On Earth,

0:47.6

We're Briefly Gorgeous.

0:53.7

The book, which was an immediate bestseller, was an excavation of his family's history in Vietnam, which is where

0:55.7

Bong was born and raised until the family immigrated to America when he was just two years old.

1:01.8

And it was here, stateside, in Connecticut, that Bong came of age in a one-bedroom apartment

1:06.8

with seven relatives, a mother who worked long hours at the local nail salon, and a father

1:12.8

who eventually left one day and never came back. By the time Ocean was a teenager, he was the first

1:19.4

in his family to read and write proficiently. But that's only part of how he became a novelist

1:25.4

and poet. The other part is the basis of his latest book,

1:29.2

The Emperor of Gladness, a personal history of his years as a wayward teen, bouncing back and

1:35.2

forth between East Hartford and New York City, dipping in and out of sobriety. In the opening pages,

1:42.2

we find our protagonist, named High High on the edge of a bridge

1:46.0

ready to jump, that is, until he's flagged down by Grisina, an elderly Lithuanian immigrant,

1:52.8

who happens to see him from her front yard. In a moment of generosity from her and a moment of

1:58.8

desperation for him, Hye moves in and effectively becomes her live-in nurse,

2:04.1

while also balancing a job at a local restaurant called Home Market,

2:08.9

which has all the features of a Boston market.

2:11.9

As you'll hear, the parallels between Ocean's lived experiences

...

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