Hello and welcome to this podcast extra of the bottom line on how to build a racially diverse business.

Now when I was speaking to the prominent black business leader Karen Blakett, the UK boss of the ad giant WPP for the programme,

turned out to be such a fascinating chat I thought you'd like to hear more.

So here it is. We touched on topics from unconscious white bias in the workplace, so-called blind CVs,

which aim to recruit a more diverse workforce to the ethnic pay gap.

She told me about the obstacles faced at work by people like herself

who were not white, male and crucially middle class. I believe that prejudice exists whether

you're a woman, whether it's about your race, whether it's about your social class.

And I think for the industry at that time, it was very much a closed network. It really was,

you know, group think was happening because you did recruit from the same places. You know,

conscious and unconscious bias does exist. And when it came to the next hire or the next promotion,

at that time, people tended to hire in their mirror image or promote in their mirror image because that's what they were comfortable with and that's what they knew.

To my face, have I ever sort of experienced outright racism?

To my face, no.

There's always been the odd murmur or whisper or comment.

You know, people term it microaggressions. And I keep saying it's not a microaggression to the

person on the receiving end. And it can not your confidence. Can you give me an example? Because I think

people would be interested to know the kind of thing that you're talking about. Oh, there's always a comment about your hair, or there's a comment about the brightness of your clothes and how it matches your skin tone, or, you know, it's just a comment. So that might be, that might be well intention, no? Or you, or you think it's actually a subtle put-down? I don't know if it's a put-down. I think it's people just not even realizing what they're saying. You know, with your skin tone, you can get away with that colour. Or, you know, a comment about the size of your lips. You could take shares out in those. or it's those little comments.

I mean, that I wouldn't know.

No, that one I would put in a different category.

Yeah.

I put that one in a different category.

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