Personally, as a designer, as an artist, you just keep making even if it's bad to you.

And that's a thing, right?

Something that's bad to you may be beautiful to someone else.

You don't know that, unless you put that into the world.

And we're often such harsh, awful critics for ourselves that I think it's just important

to keep making even if it's not in the medium that you are earning a living in.

Welcome back to Working.

I'm your host, Isaac Butler.

And I'm your other host, Karen Han.

Karen, it is so nice to talk to you again.

How was your holiday?

It was pretty good.

Um, I mean, obviously the level of good is relative because the number of things that

we can do right now safely is kind of limited.

It's like three things, right?

Kind of, yeah.

And my holiday was all, we didn't see anybody.

We didn't do anything that required being around other people.

So it was all right.

How was your holiday?

It was good.

My mother-in-law came up to stay and then we were pretty sure her flight would be canceled.

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