In the absence of some defeater, it seems to me, that we're perfectly within our rights

in believing that there is an objective realm of moral values and duties,

just as we're within our rights and believing that there is a world of physical objects around us.

Hey, hey, and welcome. This is the Ben Shapiro Show Sunday special, and we're eager to welcome to the program, philosopher and theologian, Dr. William Lane Craig. He's also the author

of the book, On Guard, and the President of Reasonable Faith. We'll get to that conversation in just

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Go to do that. You want to make sure that your family is okay if, God forbid, something should happen to you. Prepare like an adult. Go to policy genius.com. Again, that is policy genius.com. Go check them out right now. They do make life insurance easy. Dr. Craig, thanks so much for stopping by. I really appreciate your time. My pleasure. Good to be with you. So why don't we start with this? We're living in an increasingly secular age, where people, by polling number,

seculares are now, by polling numbers, the largest religious

constituency in America. Why do you think we're seeing such a decline in religious belief in the West

right now? I think what's happening is not so much increasing secularization, Ben been as the collapse of the old mainline

Christian denominations like the Episcopalians, the Catholics, the Presbyterians, the

congregationalists, and so forth. And as a result, there is an increasing polarization in American society.

People are evacuating the middle and going either to the secular end or to the evangelical

end.

Evangelicals are maintaining their percentage of the American population, keeping up with the population growth. But the

impression of increasing secularization exists because the middle is emptying out. And these

old line denominations are collapsing. Why do you think they are collapsing in on themselves?

And we're seeing it in Judaism as well, the old conservative Jews and reform

...