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The Ezra Klein Show

Why Housing Is So Expensive — Particularly in Blue States

The Ezra Klein Show

New York Times Opinion

Society & Culture, Government, News

4.611K Ratings

🗓️ 19 July 2022

⏱️ 77 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

America is experiencing a housing crisis — or, more accurately, multiple housing crises. A massive housing shortage in major cities has resulted in skyrocketing rents. Low- and middle-income individuals find themselves priced out of the places with the most opportunity. Homelessness is rampant in cities across the country. Developers often face the steepest obstacles to building in the places where new housing is needed most. And young people are increasingly viewing homeownership, once a vital part of the American dream, as hopelessly out of reach. These outcomes weren’t inevitable. Plenty of other countries supply their populations with high-quality housing at lower prices. And the solutions here are incredibly simple: Build more housing in places where it’s needed, build cheaper forms of housing, build housing alongside public transit, provide more housing vouchers. So why don’t we act on them? Jenny Schuetz is a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution and the author of the new book “Fixer Upper: How to Repair America’s Broken Housing Systems,” which is perhaps the best, clearest overview of America’s housing problems to date. We discuss why the states with the highest homelessness rates are all governed by Democrats, the roots of America’s homelessness crisis, why economists believe the U.S. gross domestic product could be over a third — a third! — higher today if American cities had built more housing, why it’s so hard to build housing where it’s needed most, the actual (and often misunderstood) causes of gentrification, why public housing has such a bad reputation in the U.S.; how progressives’ commitment to local democracy and community voice surprisingly lies at the heart of America’s housing crises, why homeownership is still the primary vehicle of wealth accumulation in America (and the toxic impact that has on our politics), what the U.S. can learn from the housing policies of countries like Germany and France, what it would take to build a better politics of housing and much more. Mentioned: “The Left-NIMBY canon” by Noah Smith The Homevoter Hypothesis by William A. Fischel The Paradox of Democracy by Zac Gershberg and Sean Illing Recommendations: Crabgrass Frontier by Kenneth T. Jackson Neighborhood Defenders by Katherine Levine Einstein, David M. Glick and Maxwell Palmer Maid (Netflix series) Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected]. You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs. “The Ezra Klein Show” is produced by Annie Galvin and Rogé Karma; fact-checking by Michelle Harris, Mary Marge Locker, Kate Sinclair and Rollin Hu; mixing by Sonia Herrero and Isaac Jones; original music by Isaac Jones; audience strategy by Shannon Busta. Special thanks to Kristin Lin and Kristina Samulewski.

Transcript

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0:00.0

I'm Ezra Klein. This is the Ezra Kuncho.

0:23.0

If you've been listening to the show or reading my columns lately, you know I'm circling

0:27.3

this question of why liberalism so often fails to build. Most of all in the places liberals

0:33.2

hold the most power. And there's no more damning or central example of this failure than

0:39.7

housing. The five states in the US with the highest rates of homelessness are New York,

0:45.8

Hawaii, California, Oregon, and Washington. Some of the bluest states in the country, not

0:51.8

one red state on that list. And they are consistently unable to build enough homes at prices

0:58.7

people can actually afford. And at the core of that failure is the failure to build enough

1:03.5

homes full stop. And that means working class people can't live where the wages are highest.

1:09.3

They can't live where the opportunities for them are most promising where the safety

1:13.6

nets are most expansive. That means people who might want to live in say states that

1:18.6

guarantee abortion rates can't afford to. That means a state like California that prides

1:25.0

itself on all the green energy infrastructure it's building is pricing people who would

1:29.6

want to live in that infrastructure. Industates where they use more fossil fuels or it's

1:34.6

pricing people into parts of California itself where they have to drive much further into

1:39.4

work. Housing is fundamental when you fail to provide it that failure reverberates

1:45.2

throughout society at least waste to all your other carefully laid policy plans and ideals.

1:52.7

Few understand the ins and outs of America's housing system or systems like Jenny Shoyts.

1:58.9

She is a senior fellow at the Brookings Institute and she's the author of the new book Fixer

2:03.6

Upper How to Repair America's Broken Housing Systems which is one of the clearest

2:09.6

overviews of America's housing policy failures and just it's housing policies that you'll

2:15.2

find. But reading it a much deeper argument struck me throughout. This is very much a

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