corporations much more so than civil rights organizations have traditionally been able to afford the best most experienced and creative lawyers in the country and have used those resources to really expand their rights

if you do not provide those resources to really expand their rights.

If you do not prevail in this case, the unions will have less political influence, yes or no?

Yes, they will have less political influence. But isn't that the end of this case?

Yeah. Hi there, and welcome back to Amicus Slate's podcast about the courts and the Supreme Court and the Law.

The justices were back in their big puffy chairs on Maryland Avenue this week, and they made some news with a decision in Jennings versus Rodriguez. That's a case that was filed by a group of immigrants who were being held

indefinitely as they awaited the outcome of their deportation hearings. They wanted to have a new

bond hearing every six months. The court in a 5-3 vote with Elena Kagan recused, told them no.

The court also declined to hear a big DACA case out of California, which, as Linda Greenhouse said,

on this very show a few weeks ago, they weren't going to hear. That's because the Ninth Circuit

hasn't even heard it yet. The case was kicked back to go through the regular procedure. The Supreme Court will presumably hear it soon. And the justices heard arguments in a whole bunch of cases raising questions around free speech at your polling place and whether Microsoft has to turn over emails they've stored in Ireland. So that all happened, few, and we will be unpacking

the details in the weeks and months to come. But this week, we want to take you first into the

courtroom to hear some of the oral arguments in the public sector union fees case. That's Janice.

And even though we talked about it in fairly great detail on the last show, it really was such an incredibly dramatic argument. We want to put it in your earbuds. And also, I think it's worth reiterating the stakes in this case are just extraordinarily high for the future of organized labor. So later in the show, we're going to talk to

Adam Winkler, who's amazingly timely new book, We the Corporations, how American businesses won their

civil rights has just dropped. But first, let's just dip our heads into oral argument in Janus

from Monday morning. And joining us to talk about the case is one of the

people who argued it. David Franklin, the Solicitor General of Illinois. Welcome David to

Amicus. It's great to be with you, Dahlia. And I guess I should flag that you and I are former

classmates and thus ridiculously compromised journalistically.

Full disclosure.

Okay. So, David, we talked about Janus pretty thoroughly last time on the podcast, but I'm

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