Welcome to the commentary magazine podcast for Wednesday, August 3rd,

August 2nd, 2022, I'm Noah Rothman. John is out today and Christine is out today. But with us as always is executive editor Abe Greenwald. Hey, I know.

The Washington Free Beacons. What is your title, Elyana Johnson, editor in chief, editor in chief of the Washington Free Beacon, Elyana Johnson and commentary contributing editor Eli Lake. Hey, Eli.

Hi, and also host of the reeducation and host of the reeducation podcast, which everyone should listen to and subscribe. Yeah, should. Yes, one of the few podcasts I actually listened to outside of hours. Thank you for joining us on today in a momentous day in American politics, because yesterday was a big primary night around the country.

I think we're probably going to start before we get into the actual primary results. I think I want to start with Kansas, because everybody's talking about Kansas today. Last night, a referendum, ballot initiative, put to all Kansas voters that would essentially repeal the right to get an abortion.

And Kansas voters turned out in droves. I think they almost doubled the turnout from 2018 in the primary races and voted against this initiative. And it resounding margin, 59% to 41% this went down to defeat.

And Democrats starved as they are for good news are taking this as a sign that the tide is turning that row. I mean, and there's something to say for it, because we had this Washington Post poll a couple of days ago that suggested there was more enthusiasm to vote generally to vote among those who identify as opponents hostile to abortion rights.

Then the on the pro side of the ledger, this does give them a little bit of a boost of enthusiasm, at least when row as it were is on the ballot problem is row isn't going to be on the ballot necessarily in November, but it was here and we have a pretty clear signal that even in Kansas, right red Kansas, an anti abortion measure did not pass guys, what do you think of this?

Well, I mean, you know, look, this is the thing about about putting it back to the states, you can chew when it is on the ballot, you can you can any state can choose to do what it what it wants to do and I'm not as shocked as some people are about this to be honest.

And the thing about having something like this on the ballot that would that would lay the groundwork for taking away this states rights to abortion is that it is entirely conceivable that you can vote against this and vote Republican in fact given given where the victory was there's good reason to think that's exactly what what what hasn't will happen.

So Eli that's a very interesting point, you know, the conservative movement such as it is is generally pro life, but every poll just about of Republicans self identified Republicans when you put the issue of making abortion illegal flatly illegal cross the board to Republicans roughly 30% thereabouts of people who identify as Republican voters do not support that position.

I think it's probably a higher number because it was a free position, it was a free opinion when it was a matter that was settled by the Supreme Court now that it is a live issue back in debate.

You know, one of the benefits of that is that it gives them Americans a chance to come to a kind of consensus compromise on this issue in a way that Europe has, which is neither.

You know, the more radical abortion on demand or third trimester abortions, but it's also not going to be a flat out ban and I think that there's a lesson here for the pro life movement oddly a lesson they can learn in my view from second wave feminism and that goes like this.

The real accomplishment of the second wave feminist was not in the end they failed legislatively to get was the equal rights amendment.

The real accomplishment in my view and I talk about this in a recent hot guest episode is the effect that the second wave feminist had on our culture, which is that attitudes have so changed the last half century that the view that women were too emotional or not, you know, didn't have the attitude to compete with the highest levels in our society for the most important jobs has been demolished and it's been demolished by very, very brilliant women.

Like Eliana and others who have taken jobs that were traditionally for men in our society and shown that they can do them just as well.

So in some ways it was a cultural win that was more important than the political win at the feminist got and I think that that's the lesson for the pro life movement, which is that if you really want to change this if you want to reduce the number of abortions that people are having.

You have to understand that it's really a cultural issue and it's not a legal question of trying to legislate it away, even though I understand the argument if you believe it's murder murder should be illegal I get all that.

But at the same time instead of focusing, you know, you did the work of organizing in the federalist society and getting this Supreme Court to such a point where you overturned what I agree is poor constitutional decision from 1973 congratulations.

And now the work is you have to win over the hearts and minds you have to change American culture and that's something where you know go back and kind of learn that lesson from Betty for Danny glorious, right, who's main accomplishment is that they changed American culture so that we are very different country today.

Then we were 50 years ago when it comes to a whole host of women, kind of quality gender equality questions and things like that.

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