What really makes humans tick? And what’s going on in Number 10?
The Two Matts
Podmasters
4.4 • 523 Ratings
🗓️ 3 July 2025
⏱️ 65 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
The Matts are joined by Jonathan Goodman, author of Invisible Rivals, a fascinating book about what really makes the world go round and its consequences for religion, politics and media. It’s a revelatory conversation that will change how you think about society. Also the tragic death of Diogo Jota and his brother, plus what the hell is going on in Number Ten? Enjoy!
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | Now, before we get into the podcast, a quick message. |
| 0:02.2 | The New World is journalism with a spine, smart, sharp, and it's asking the questions |
| 0:07.0 | others dodge. |
| 0:08.4 | We dig into power, hypocrisy, and the hidden forces shaping politics and culture, with |
| 0:13.6 | writing that respects your intelligence and never wastes your time. |
| 0:18.3 | So if you're tired of the noise, craving clarity, the New World is where |
| 0:23.1 | you belong. So subscribe now. Find out what's making us the fastest growing political and cultural |
| 0:29.0 | magazine in the UK for the past four years running. And you'll discover a magazine that doesn't |
| 0:35.7 | just give you great journalism. |
| 0:39.3 | It gives you great hope for the future. |
| 0:41.6 | Go to the newworld.com.com. UK forward slash two mats. |
| 0:44.4 | That's the number two, M-A-T-T-S, |
| 0:47.0 | for a very special offer just for two-mats listeners. |
| 0:50.9 | That's the newworld.com.com. |
| 0:52.1 | UK forward slash two mats. Enjoy the podcast. |
| 1:00.7 | Hello and happy Thursday. Happy Thursday one and all. |
| 1:05.5 | Hope you are enjoying your Thursday. This is the two mats podcast brought to you by the |
| 1:09.8 | subscribers, the lovely subscribers of the new world. And we've got a great show for you today. In the second half, which we'll get to in about 15 minutes or so, we've just recorded a fantastic, fascinating interview with Jonathan Goodman, who is an anthropologist, social scientist, Cambridge academic, |
| 1:28.0 | but he's written an amazing book called Invisible Rivals. |
| 1:30.5 | It really challenges lots of things and really makes you think. |
| 1:33.8 | Well, it makes you think about the whole way we all operate. |
| 1:37.5 | Precisely, yeah. |
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