Welcome. You're listening to the Naval podcast, your authoritative source for new knowledge.

We're trying something new today. I have three frontier founders with us, three good-looking guys actually, and a fourth good-looking guy, Naval.

And let me just introduce everybody. Guillermo the G. Rausch, he's building Vurcell into an AI cloud for the world of agents and whatever comes after that.

Good to be here.

Blake Schall. He's building supersonic aircraft in his own factory and jet engines as well.

Blake's company, Boom Supersonic. And then Max Hodak from science, he's building a biohybrid brain interface

that grows living neurons on silicon to restore sensory functions like sight, but then eventually

to explore new parts of the brain and new senses. All three of these guys are not composing

their products with off-the-shelf parts. They're building their

own factories. And we don't care as much about what they're building exactly as we do about

what they're learning about how they're building. What's the new knowledge they're generating?

What's their alpha? What principles are they discovering that other founders can learn from?

What are they trying to

figure out right now? And also, what are the cutting edge or crazy ideas that they haven't even

talked about yet and they're still forming in their brains? Nival, do you have any reactions to any

of that before I jump into Guillermo? Yeah, let's just have fun. Yeah, you guys should just jump in.

Yeah, so I can't remember my exact quote, by the way, but I've been really

appealed with this idea of software factories and the job of the engineer being something

that you just show up to work, used to ship the output directly, and everything inside the company was, you know, how good is person A at shipping output B?

And now what's happening is the way that I'm judging you as an engineer is like, are you producing the factory that will produce multiplicative outputs B through Z, right?

And that's a pretty significant change because basically, like, we used to believe it

and it would be somewhat controversial that there's 10x engineers.

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