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In February 1945, the Allies, led by Sir Arthur Harris and Bomber Command, destroyed the historic city of Dresden, killing 25,000, most of them civilians.

For the 75th anniversary, Sinclair McKay, author of Dresden, The Fire and the Darkness, and A.N. Wilson,

join me, William Moore, to discuss whether it should be regarded as a war crime.

You can read an edited version of this conversation in This Week Spectator.

Sinclair, maybe start with you.

Would you define the bombings of Dresden as a war crime? It was a barbaric act. But yes, I hesitate about war crime because I think

as Professor Donald Hexham, I have to check his name actually,

who argued elsewhere, war crime is a legal term and not a moral one.

And it's a legally defined concept.

Certainly at one stage of 20th century history,

was a crime deliberately to kill non-comitants and civilian?

Yes.

Who weren't in the line of fire of normal warfare?

Indeed so, but there are then a number of follow-on questions that then come with the label war crime,

which is, I suppose, first of all, who would you accuse of having committed this crime?

Who would be held most responsible?

Who would stand trial at that tribunal?

Well, I mean, one of the greatest columnists, the spectators ever had, Obron War,

regularly used to say what's a pity it was in 1945 since they had the Nuremberg trials,

...