This is the Read to Lead podcast.

Episode 565, May 2025.

What I wanted to do was democratize these steps in such a way that everybody, regardless

of what their fix of choices, could derive the same benefits from those steps that for the

past 90 years, people in the rooms of recovery have experience.

They're for everybody.

Did you know that anyone, addicts or non-addicts, that means you, can benefit from working

the 12 steps and find the freedom, joy, and intimacy with God that your heart longs for?

It's true.

Hi, I'm Jeff, and this is the Read to Lead podcast, the podcast dedicated to your personal

and professional growth.

We all suffer from a sense of spiritual homelessness, according to today's guest, a feeling

that we're not fully at home in the world.

To cope with our painful feelings and life traumas, we search for quick fixes that eventually

become habitual, self-destructive behaviors that ultimately create more

problems than they solve. We'll tackle these ideas and more with today's guest, Ian Morgan

Prawn. He's a best-selling author, psychotherapist, Enneagram Teacher, Episcopal Priest,

and the host of the popular podcast typology, but currently over

20 million downloads. His books include the Enneagram Primer, which I love, called The Road

Back to You, an Enneagram Journey to Self-Discovery, which is sold over one million copies,

the novel Chasing Francis, the spiritual memoir, Jesus, My Father, the CIA, and me,

and the story of you, an enneagram journey to becoming your true self. Ian's latest book,

...