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Hello, I'm Catherine Phil, diplomatic correspondent at the Times.

Welcome to the Intelligence Squared podcast.

You can sign up for regular updates about podcasts and other events at Intelligence Squared.com.

I'm here with Tim Marshall, journalist and author of Divided,

why we're living in an age of walls.

Tim, welcome.

Thank you.

An age of walls.

I had a look at some statistics on this. It turns out that at the end of World War II, there were 15 walls.

They were now 77. And the vast majority have gone up since 9-11.

...