If you give me just a current event, a development, my instinct is to ask, well, what happened before that?

Yeah.

And what happened before that?

Yeah.

What was before that?

Like, when do we get to the firmament, you know?

Jelani Cobb is the dean of Columbia's Graduate School of Journalism, a staff writer at The New Yorker, a political analyst, and a Peabody Award-winning filmmaker. He is also the author of several books, including his most recent work titled Three or More Is a Riot, Notes on How We Got Here, 2012 to 2025, which he is

here to talk with me about today. Since the Black Lives Matter movement emerged more than a decade ago, Jelani has been reporting on the most consequential events from the front lines, and three or more as a riot takes previously published pieces and updates them using present and historical context, turning these dispatches from the past into a retrospective on what our modern fight

for racial justice has meant for the nation and for Jolani himself.

I'm your host, Chelsea Weber Smith, and this is American Hysteria.

I'm so excited to welcome Jelani to the show.

I feel like this is going to be a really interesting interview.

So thank you so much for being here.

Thank you.

I'm happy to be here.

So you have a new book out.

Three or More is a Riot is the first part of the title. I would love if you wanted to

explain, first of all, why you chose that title for your new book. Sure. First, you know,

thank you for the invitation. I'm happy to be here and to talk with you. And the title of the book preceded the book.

You know, I had this phrase that was kind of bouncing around in my head.

And, you know, it was inspired, you know, during the time when I was covering, you know,

a really difficult story.

...