This is the waves. This is the waves. This is the waves. This is the waves. Welcome to the waves. Slates

podcast about gender, feminism and begging people to stop trying to make Ted Bundy sexy. Every

episode you get a new pair of women to talk about the things we can't get off our minds and today

you've got me, Shayna Roth, producer of this show The Waves and author of Cold Cases A True Crime

Collection. Right in Cold Cases and especially promoting it when it came out about a year ago, I

honestly couldn't stop thinking about whether the book that I had put out into the world was

for lack of a better word a problem. It's a collection of 10 unsolved cases ranging from

mass murders to heist, but it was the murders and disappearances chapters that I kept worrying

about, chapters about Jambane Ramsey, Natalie Holloway and Elizabeth Short, also known as the

Black Dahlia, specifically. And by problem, I mean I was concerned that I was contributing to

a culture that was out of control. True Crime has become something of an industry. I mean there's

conferences, live tapings of True Crime podcasts. And if you type in True Crime on Etsy, you will

get more than 23,000 hits with shirts, candles, bookmarks, mugs, stickers, cards and more that say

things like True Crime, glass of wine, embed by nine and just here to establish an alibi. There's

just tons of this stuff out there. And True Crime itself has fans that range from sort of the

casual to the chaotic and true crime podcasts, books, documentaries and series. I mean they're just

all over the place. I'm a former prosecutor and I have always been fascinated by crime.

I love mysteries, always have. But as I was writing, I kept seeing patterns that were concerning to

me. So in a lot of the cases, particularly ones that were where the victims were women, usually

white women, those were the cases where I found the most research. They had the most documentaries

and podcasts and things like that about them. And this is something that I think is evolving.

There are more and more True Crime documentaries that are focused on things like wrongful imprisonment

...