The Truth about Sam Altman (Robert Wright & Timothy B. Lee)

Robert Wright's Nonzero

Nonzero

News & Politics, Society & Culture, Philosophy

4.7 • 618 Ratings

🗓️ 26 June 2025

⏱️ 49 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit www.nonzero.org

0:28 The dueling Sam Altman biographies 4:36 Who is the real Sam Altman? 16:06 OpenAI’s origin—did Sam scam Elon? 20:50 Why the OpenAI board coup failed 35:27 Good and bad critiques of OpenAI 47:14 Heading to Overtime

Robert Wright (Nonzero, The Evolution of God, Why Buddhism Is True) and Timothy B. Lee (Full Stack Economics, Understanding AI, AI Summer). Recorded June 16, 2025.

Twitter: https://twitter.com/NonzeroPods

Transcript

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0:00.0	You're listening to Robert Wright's Non-Zero podcast. You're listening to Robert Wright's Non-Zero Podcast.
0:29.3	Hi, Tim.
0:30.6	Hi, Bob.
0:31.0	How's it going?
0:32.5	Can't complain, Tim.
0:34.7	Let me introduce this.
0:35.9	I'm Robert Wright, publisher, the Non-Zero Newsletter. This This is a non-zero podcast. You're Timothy B. Lee, publisher of the influential AI newsletter, Understanding AI. And we are going to settle a question once and for all. Sam Altman, Good or Evil.
0:57.8	We've both read very informative books about him.
0:59.2	I actually listened to them.
1:00.0	Sam.
1:04.7	One of them has hit the bestsellers list, Empire of AI by Karen Howe. Congratulations to her.
1:07.5	And then the other is called The Optimist.
1:10.8	Actually, I'm not looking at the author's name right now.
1:16.0	It's Hege.
1:16.6	It's her name.
1:17.8	Do you know her?
1:19.0	I don't know.
1:20.1	I think she's at the journal.
1:21.8	Yeah, she is.
1:24.8	Anyway, so this is kind of a comparative book review, but also I'm going to be pressing you on the good or evil question.
1:33.3	I know I have my views.
1:35.6	But for starters, what would you, I found them both engrossing.
	...

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