Hi, dear listeners, this is Kate Riga. I'm here to make a quick pitch that you consider becoming

a TPM Prime member. TPM has used the member model for over a decade now, and our loyal members

are the only reason we've been able to weather the turbulence of the media landscape and avoid the

fate that has befallen so many other independent outlets. For $70, you get no paywall, fewer ads,

access to the Hive member forum, a member's only newsletter, and more. For $100, you get no paywall, fewer ads, access to the Hive member forum,

a member's only newsletter, and more. For $140 a year, you get all of that, plus no ads at all.

Without our members, there is no podcast, not to mention that I'm out of a job. Thank you so much

for listening and supporting us. We couldn't do it without you.

Thank you so much for listening and supporting us. We couldn't do it without you. Hey, my name is Josh Kavanaugh. I'm here with Joe Ragazo for the social club, TPM's newest

podcast. How you doing, Joe? Good. How are you doing? I'm good. I'm excited. We have our first

non-TPM interview for you guys today, and it's with the journalist Jacob Solerman. What do you think,

Joe? How did that go?

It went well. I, speaking for myself, it was nice to be interviewing someone again, just for the

audience's knowledge. I was a journalist. Like, I used to be a journalist. I've been on the business

side for a long time. And it was nice to kind of exercise some muscles

that had atrophied. And I thought it was a great topic. There's like so much to dig into with tech

and crypto and Jacob is just so extremely knowledgeable. So I had a great time. That was awesome.

Yeah, Jacob was a great guest. I mean, we talked about a book he recently published,

that kind of goes into Silicon Valley and how a bunch of the kind of big figures there,

you know, from Elon Musk to lesser known figures like Sean McGuire, David Sachs,

people who you probably have heard of like Peter Thiel, you know, became really, really right wing in this kind of unique way where they say that they envision like a world that is purely libertarian and ungoverned, but what they really want to do is govern it with like kind of like, from what he was saying, it sounded like an iron fist. And, you know, I think Jacob did a really good job of kind of chronicling how that came to be and what it means. Yeah, it's an interesting subject for a lot of reasons. I mean, first of all, it's like super consequential to everything we do.

I mean, we're using technology now.

...