Hey everyone, this week we're going to bring you something a little different.

It's an episode from a podcast series we really liked called Timber Wars.

It comes from Oregon Public Broadcasting and was one of a handful of projects that NPR picked

to go through its story lab incubator, which is pretty cool.

It's the story of old growth forests, a motley recruse of owl, environmentalists,

and the logging industry, and how they all converged in the 1990s to make the Pacific Northwest

a battleground, a hugely divisive political battleground.

When we come back, how the spotted owl found itself the most controversial bird in the nation.

And how that bird galvanized the fight between industry and those who wanted to protect the environment.

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Since the 1980s, hip hop and America's prisons have grown side by side.

And we're going to investigate this connection to see how it lifts us up and holds us down.

Hip hop is talking about what we live, trying to live the American dream,

felon at the American dream. I'm Sydney Mellon. I'm Rodney Carmichael. Listen now to the

louder than a riot podcast from NPR Music. Where we chase the collision of rhyme and punishment in America.

Just to set you up, in the previous episode we learned about the complex ecological wonders

that are old growth forests. From one of the first scientists to study them, a guy named Jerry

Franklin. By the time scientists like Jerry Franklin and Norm Johnson knew enough about old growth

...