Gide, humans. Welcome to the show that doesn't deal in absolutes, that doesn't deal in blacks and whites.

So many shows, so many politicians, so many commentators, so much of your social media feed

expects either your agreement or disagreement, either your furious love or your furious anger.

I do not.

I ask only that we give each other the benefit of the doubt,

that we wrestle with ideas we reject,

as well as those we think are right.

Let's escape the dogmas of conventional wisdom.

Let's have conversations that straddle the cultural divide

and make us all just a little uncomfortable.

Today on the show, if you're a fan of one of the world's most popular political podcasts,

the Slate Political Gab Fest, then today's guest needs no introduction.

If you're not a fan of that podcast, you should be.

David Plotz, Emily Bazelon, and CBS's John Dickerson sit down,

and they basically had the idea of doing a political podcast

that was a bit like

the green room at one of the Sunday morning political shows before or after the actual show

where people really say what they believe instead of what they're supposed to say in sound bites

for the mass media consumption. And that's always been Plotsey's way. I knew David somewhat when I was living in New York City.

He actually was my first guest on my old now-defunct podcast, We the People Live, after the election of Donald Trump.

He and I sat down and prognosticated about what could be. Take a listen to some of that exchange.

You're pointing to the big, to the elephant in the room here, which is the extent to which Trump is tameable, right?

...