From Outside Magazine and PRX, this is the outside interview.

I'm just going to test your guys' mics with Chris Katz.

If you've been paying any attention to the Olympics this year, you probably know that just before it started, a lot of Russian athletes were banned using performance enhancing drugs, or PEDs. Then just a few weeks later

some of the athletes were unband if they could prove that they were clean. The

report from the World Anti-Doping Agency outlined a system of state-sponsored doping

dating all the way back to 2011.

So even the 270 athletes that were cleared to compete didn't seem completely clean. In fact since the report I found

myself assuming the worst about anyone who wins anything. Even outside's editor-in-chief,

Chris Kies.

First of all, to orient myself, what was your relay this weekend?

Oh, it was the, uh, it was a Ragnar relay in Angel Fire New Mexico.

Pretty fun. We actually, it was the first one there last year and our team won it, like completely unexpectedly. Like we went there just to have fun and about three quarters through the race somebody on the team was like, I think we're in the lead and all of us were like no way and and what did your PED

regiment look like leading up to this? A lot of rice crispy treats and no there's not a lot of

PEDs I wish there were some PEDs in my repertoire, especially now that I'm 42, but yeah, I'm afraid I'm afraid I was racing pretty clean.

Sorry Chris, but this is what everyone says when they win a race.

It's just a matter of eating this or drinking that and training hard.

No one believes you, man.

And according to author Mark Johnson, they shouldn't.

Johnson writes mostly about pro-cycling, and his new book,

Spitting in the Soup, outlines a history of doping that goes back to the very

origin of the Olympic Games. But back then he says, everyone knew about it.

You know, I think what was fascinating to me about the book and why I initially wanted to read it was the opening

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