The Mytilenaean Debate

In Our Time

BBC

History

4.6 • 9.8K Ratings

🗓️ 20 June 2019

⏱️ 54 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Melvyn Bragg and guests discuss why Athenians decided to send a fast ship to Lesbos in 427BC, rowing through the night to catch one they sent the day before. That earlier ship had instructions to kill all adult men in Mytilene, after their unsuccessul revolt against Athens, as a warning to others. The later ship had orders to save them, as news of their killing would make others fight to the death rather than surrender. Thucydides retells this in his History of the Peloponnesian War as an example of Athenian democracy in action, emphasising the right of Athenians to change their minds in their own interests, even when a demagogue argued they were bound by their first decision.

With

Angela Hobbs Professor of the Public Understanding of Philosophy at the University of Sheffield

Lisa Irene Hau Senior Lecturer in Classics at the University of Glasgow

And

Paul Cartledge Emeritus AG Leventis Professor of Greek Culture, University of Cambridge and Senior Research Fellow of Clare College

Producer: Simon Tillotson

Transcript

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0:00.0	BBC Sounds, Music, Radio, Podcasts.
0:04.9	Thanks for downloading this episode of In Our Time.
0:07.6	There's a reading list to go with it on our website and you can get news about our programs
0:11.4	if you follow us on Twitter at BBC In Our Time.
0:14.8	I hope you enjoyed the programs.
0:16.6	Hello, in 427BC, the Athenians voted to kill all adult men in Italy on Les Boss, where
0:22.9	they just crushed a revolt and to enslave the women and children and raise the city to
0:27.1	the ground.
0:28.5	When they had second thoughts the next day, they debated if such a brutal act really
0:32.1	was in the interests of Athens and if not, were they allowed to change their minds.
0:36.8	By a narrow margin, they voted on a lighter punishment and their sailors then rode through
0:40.5	the night carrying new orders to stop the slaughter.
0:43.4	As the city deities tells it, the Athenians had been on the brink of losing their moral
0:47.0	compass and had saved themselves just in time.
0:50.2	We need to discuss the Matelinae in debate, our Angie Hobbs, professor of the Public
0:54.5	Understanding of Philosophy at the University of Sheffield, Nisa Ha, senior lecturer in classics
1:00.0	at the University of Glasgow and Paul Cartelage, emeritus, agent, levantist, professor of
1:04.7	Greek culture at the University of Cambridge and research fellow at Claire College.
1:08.8	Paul Cartelage, this debate happened in the context of the Peloponnesian War.
1:12.6	What had prompted that war?
1:14.3	It's what we normally call the Peloponnesian War.
1:16.5	It's really the Athenian Peloponnesian War, depends which side you are on and which side
	...

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