meta_pixel
Tapesearch Logo
Log in
Rational Security

The “Leftover Chicken Kyiv” Edition

Rational Security

The Lawfare Institute

Foreignpolicy, Nationalsecurity, News, Government, Politics, Middleeast

4.82K Ratings

🗓️ 26 February 2025

⏱️ 84 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

This week, Scott joined his Lawfare colleagues Benjamin Wittes, Natalie Orpett, and Anastasiia Lapatina for a rare, all-in-person discussion of the week’s big national security news, including:

  • “Chicken Kyiv, Served Cold.” The Trump administration’s vision for a peace settlement in Ukraine is coming into focus—and it’s not the one many Ukrainians and Europeans were hoping for. In negotiations that have largely excluded Ukrainian and European partners—and amidst a barrage of hostile attacks on Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s democratic legitimacy—the Trump administration appears to be insisting on some U.S. stake in Ukraine’s rare earth minerals while remaining unwilling to support Ukraine’s NATO membership and resistant to providing hard security guarantees in response. Are the contours of such a deal something Ukraine can agree to? And will it advance U.S. and Ukrainian national security interests?
  • “Euro Vision.” In some of his first comments since emerging from elections as Germany’s new chancellor, Friedrich Merz called for European independence from the United States, in light of the Trump administration’s increasing neglect (and even hostility) to longstanding transatlantic partnerships. And Ukraine may be the first front for this new policy orientation, as European officials have suggested an increased willingness to deploy ground troops to Ukraine, increase their own assistance levels, and even make an alternate offer for access to Ukraine’s rare earth minerals. How much potential is there for a truly independent European foreign policy? And what will it mean for U.S. national interests?
  • “Baywatch Reruns.” As part of its aggressive campaign against undocumented migrants, the Trump administration has expanded its use of the detention facility at Guantanamo Bay for what it claims to be the “worst of the worst” undocumented migrants involved in violent crimes. But recent reporting has cast serious doubt on whether everyone who has been detained at Guantanamo meets this qualification, while others have raised questions about the conditions in which detainees are being held and the legal basis for the involvement of military personnel. What is the Trump administration really trying to accomplish? And is Guantanamo Bay once again becoming a black mark on American rule of law?

In object lessons, Natalie confirmed the existence of the year’s most top-secret, exclusive diplomatic gathering—the Lawfare Baby Summit. Anastasiia unveiled Escalation, a long-anticipated narrative podcast series from Lawfare and Goat Rodeo about the history of the U.S.-Ukraine relationship. Scott—in true elder Millennial fashion—identified with the gracefully aging, definitely not old, Before Trilogy from Richard Linklater. And Ben marked the third anniversary of Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine with a somber reflection on the sparse turnout at a Lincoln Memorial rally over the weekend, underscoring the ongoing challenge of building mass political movements from within small communities.

We value your feedback! Help us improve by sharing your thoughts at lawfaremedia.org/survey. Your input ensures that we deliver what matters most to you. Thank you for your support—and, as always, for listening!

Use promo code RATIONALSECURITY at the link below to get an exclusive 60% off an annual Incogni plan:

https://incogni.com/rationalsecurity



Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Hey there, Lawfare listeners. Editor-in-chief Benjamin Wittes here with a quick favor to ask,

0:06.4

we want to hear from you to make Lawfare as insightful and engaging as possible. Whether you read

0:13.3

our in-depth national security law and policy analysis, listen to our podcasts, watch our

0:20.5

live streams, whether you're an occasional reader

0:23.5

or a true superfan, your feedback is essential to helping us improve. We've put together a

0:30.1

short audience survey, and while we know you're busy, we'd really appreciate it if you

0:35.4

could take just a few minutes to fill it out.

0:38.6

You'll find it at lawfaremedia.org slash survey, and in the show notes of this episode,

0:45.1

your input helps us understand what's working, what's not working, what you want more of,

0:50.6

what you want less of, and how we can better serve you.

0:54.0

So when you have a moment,

0:55.8

please visit lawfaremedia.org slash survey and let us know what matters most to you. Thanks

1:02.8

for your support. And now on to today's show.

1:08.7

Guys, this is like a momentous occasion. I don't know if we've actually done this a 100% live in-person podcast recording since before the pandemic, maybe.

1:18.0

Oh, wow.

1:18.4

I mean, because, you know, usually Allen's in Minnesota and sometimes you and Quinta are in your apartments, houses, your back caves.

1:30.7

And this time, and, you know, now we have Nostia in Washington.

1:35.4

Yes.

1:35.8

Usually it's just Natalie and me in the office.

1:39.2

Holding down Lawfare HQ.

1:41.1

There you go.

1:42.4

Well, I mean, I will say we are thinking, we are planning on decommissioning our in-person

...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from The Lawfare Institute, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of The Lawfare Institute and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.

Copyright © Tapesearch 2025.