This is an IHeart podcast.

Hey, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz show on IHeart Radio.

My guest today is Lee Smith.

Lee is an author and journalist at Tablet who has a new book out called The China Matrix,

the epic story of how

Donald Trump shattered a deadly pact. Hi, Lee, so nice to have you on. Hi, Carol. Thank you so much

for the invitation. It's a real pleasure. So I don't think we've ever met in person and I'm very

excited to talk to you because you make a lot of appearances in my various group chats. People are frequently sharing

Lee Smith's work and talking about Lee Smith. So tell me, how did you become a writer? What was the

path you took? Well, my father was a journalist, and my grandfather was was a journalist too. My great-grandfather

wasn't exactly a journalist, but he was a typesetter at the New York Daily News. Wow. And so it's a lot.

So you didn't have a choice. That was. No, I had, I had a choice and, you know, had my father been

responsible, he would have said, you know, there's, there's other ways to make a living.

But, but, but he's, he's, he's happy that I pursued the same trade that he did. So yeah, I mean, you know, and then just when I was a, I mean, I think the biggest thing that what makes people want to want to write is reading, you know, what you read.

Right.

Oh, wow, that's really, I wish I could, I wish I could, I hope I can make people feel at some point how I feel about reading this, you know.

Do you know the poet Delmore Schwartz?

No.

Delmore Schwartz was a famous, you know, New York poet in the mid-20s and a very tragic story, very moving story.

Saul Bello wrote a novel called Humboldt's Gift, which is basically Delmore Schwartz.

But Schwartz said something, which I always keep in mind.

I love him as a writer.

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