The Jimmy Kimmel canceling is a tipping point for democracy
Shrinking Trump
Really American Media
4.5 • 1.1K Ratings
🗓️ 19 September 2025
⏱️ 94 minutes
🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS
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Summary
Your favorite psychologists, John Gartner and Harry Segal, review the insidious way the Trump administration is using the Kirk assassination to end freedom of speech. They are joined again by Dr. Vince Greenwood, an expert on psychopathy, who shines a spotlight on Trump’s criminal behavior.
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The episode opens with a stark diagnosis: Trump’s behavior reflects a dangerous blend of malignant narcissism and sociopathy. Gartner and Segal argue that his compulsive lying, criminality, and relentless attacks on institutions aren’t just political tactics—they’re symptoms of a deeper pathology. These traits, they warn, fuel a pattern of authoritarian maneuvering that threatens the very fabric of democratic society.
One of the most chilling segments centers on the political exploitation of tragedy. In the wake of Charlie Kirk’s murder, Trump and his allies swiftly weaponized the event to stoke anti-left sentiment and suppress dissent. Gartner and Segal dissect this response as a textbook example of fear-based control, where grief is hijacked to justify repression. They argue that this tactic not only deepens national division but also corrodes core democratic principles like free speech and pluralism.
The conversation then turns to media complicity. The psychologists critique how certain outlets, under financial or ideological pressure, have surrendered their independence and become echo chambers for Trump’s narrative. This media capture, they contend, is not incidental—it’s strategic. By dominating the information ecosystem, Trump consolidates power and silences opposition, turning journalism into a tool of authoritarian control.
Joining the discussion is Dr. Vince Greenwood, who offers a clinical assessment of Trump as a psychopath. Drawing on established diagnostic criteria, Greenwood highlights traits like impulsivity, lack of remorse, and a compulsive need to dominate. While these traits have helped Trump rise, Greenwood warns they may also be his undoing. The very pathology that fuels his power could expose vulnerabilities—cracks in the armor of authoritarianism.
The episode closes with a call to action. Gartner and Segal urge listeners to stay vigilant, resist normalization, and confront the psychological tactics that enable authoritarian rule. Understanding the cognitive and behavioral patterns of leaders, they argue, isn’t just academic—it’s essential to defending democracy.
Tune in next week for another gripping, clinically grounded exploration of power, pathology, and the urgent need to protect democratic values from psychological manipulation.
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | I'm Dr. John Gartner. |
| 0:02.0 | And I'm Dr. Harry Siegel. |
| 0:04.0 | And welcome to this session of Shrinking Trump. |
| 0:08.0 | John and I are both clinical psychologists, and this is our 68th episode. |
| 0:15.0 | And we began the show during the presidential campaign, because we're really concerned about the way in which the public, |
| 0:22.9 | the media, and the political elites were not seeing what we saw as a clear cognitive decline |
| 0:31.1 | of Donald Trump. And we saw this not from having assessed him directly, but from all of the appearances and interviews and also behaviors that we saw. |
| 0:45.3 | And we were seeing those and noting them along with his severe narcissistic personality disorder with sociopathic traits that we call malignant narcissism, |
| 0:59.7 | and that include Trump's criminal behavior, his compulsive lying, his need and wish to dominate others, as well as to tear structures down. |
| 1:14.6 | We were worried about that during the campaign, especially when people like our frequent guest, |
| 1:23.6 | Ahmed Baba talked about Project 2025 as being a blueprint for Trump to do those things. |
| 1:31.5 | And lo and behold, since his inauguration on January 20th, we have seen him systematically attack institutions of government, institutions within society, and more. |
| 1:48.6 | Right, John? |
| 1:50.2 | Yeah. |
| 1:51.0 | And we should let people know we are having a guest, Dr. Vince Greenwood at the end of the show, |
| 1:55.3 | who's an expert on psychopathy, who will help us delve a little deeper into the psychology |
| 2:00.0 | of that destructive domination of society that he's incorporating as an authoritarian strongman. |
| 2:09.2 | We're going to talk, look, the big story, obviously, is going to be about Kirk and the reaction to his murder. |
| 2:17.0 | And now, we just found out yesterday the firing of Jimmy Kimmel, you know, for daring to criticize the president. His comment about Kirk was very minor. We're going to get to all that. But we always like to start with our dementia roundup to see how much people are finally talking about this issue. So there's some good |
| 2:35.6 | news and some bad news. I guess the good news is that The Daily Beast has written an article about it |
| 2:41.6 | and actually got picked up by some of the news services. So I heard from other people that they'd read it, |
| 2:47.2 | you know, on news break or Apple News, that kind of thing. So we're going to look at that article first. |
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