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The Quanta Podcast

The Infinite Heist - Part 2

The Quanta Podcast

Quanta Magazine

Life Sciences, Science, Physics

4.7638 Ratings

🗓️ 10 March 2026

⏱️ 25 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

In 1874, Georg Cantor published one of the most important papers in math’s 4,000-year history. Some ideas in it were stolen. On this episode of The Quanta Podcast, the second of a two-parter, host Samir Patel speaks with math editor Jordana Cepelewicz about the fate of Cantor, the myths surrounding math history, and one man's search for the truth. These episodes are based on a recent Quanta story. Explore our new special series, “The Evolving Foundations of Math,” on our website.

Each week on The Quanta Podcast, Quanta Magazine editor in chief Samir Patel speaks with the people behind the award-winning publication to navigate through some of the most important and mind-expanding questions in science and math.

Audio coda courtesy of TheAlpineSisters Alphorn Players.

Transcript

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0:00.0

You're used to hearing my voice on the world, bringing you interviews from around the globe.

0:07.2

And you hear me reporting environment and climate news. I'm Carolyn Beeler.

0:12.1

And I'm Marco Werman. We're now with you hosting the world together. More global journalism with a fresh new sound.

0:18.3

Listen to the world on your local public radio station and wherever you find your podcasts.

0:34.5

In 1874, a bold, ambitious, anxious mathematician, Geyard Cantor, published a paper in which he had snuck in ideas that would upend the world of math, specifically that infinity can come in different sizes.

0:50.9

And today he's considered a kind of lone genius whose work provided the foundations of set theory

0:56.4

and in turn modern math. But it's clear that this work was partially derived from his correspondence

1:02.9

with another more reserved and more modest mathematician Richard Dedekind.

1:08.1

Cantor didn't give Dedekind any credit, and it's clear from his writing that

1:11.2

Dedekind wasn't pleased about it. But there wasn't any hard evidence of this act of intellectual

1:16.5

dishonesty. The case was circumstantial, speculative, so it had been largely dismissed by historians

1:23.1

of math.

1:30.5

I'm Samir Patel, editor-in-chief of Quanta Magazine.

1:33.6

I'm here with Quanta Math editor Jordana Sapelowitz to take us through the next twists

1:37.8

in this story.

1:39.9

So, Jordana, when we last left Cantor and Dedekind, Cantor had published his important 1874 paper,

1:47.3

and Dedekin stopped writing to him.

1:49.6

Some years later, they got back in touch,

1:52.2

and Cantor gets a new paper published in the big journal, Krell.

1:56.2

Once again, it has material in it from Dedekind without credit,

1:59.9

and Dedikin then finally cuts off

2:01.7

all contact. But more importantly, this new paper has drawn the ire of another mathematician

...

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