The

The is American ideals, but it's not as unattractive to.

Is there an inconsistency there? Yes, you could,

maybe, but it has to do very much with his temperament and his aesthetics as much as his

morals. Yeah, I mean, it seems completely coherent to me to have a disdainful attitude towards an American idealism whose

ultimate object and aim is right we talked about this in the quite American episode it's

making the world safe for Coca-Cola making the world safe for commercialism and capitalism and markets and,

you know, everyone able to be able to make a profit and get rich versus, you know,

for all of the, for all of the terrible flaws of the Soviet Union and of international communism as a movement, um, I can see someone being much more sympathetic to a person who's willing to sacrifice for, you know, what the highest aspirations are like the brotherhood of man, right? Not, not, not, not sort of the ability to make a profit, but the, you know, the ability to, you know, the dream of ending class society, the dream of having, you know, broad equality. That seems like a much more sympathetic object of admiration, even, even, you know, stipulating all the issues with actually existing communism and the actually existing Soviet Union.

I'm reading at the moment, I'm reading Tim Scheng's book, Reeliner's.

Oh, yeah.

I just listened to a podcast about that.

Which is quite good.

It's a good book.

Yeah.

And he has a whole chapter on Du Bois, sort of a pivotal intellectual in the middle

of 20th century.

And he goes quite a bit into Du Bois's sort of like turn towards communism and it's like

turned towards Soviet Union to Communist China. And it's like it's in in Du Bois's turn,

which comes, you know, in the late, the back half of his life when he's thoroughly disillusioned

with the United States. And he's very pessimistic about the ability to sort of overcome

racism and white supremacy. It's very clear that what is drawing Du Bois is to say

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