The Fish are Fleeing: How Shifting Marine Ecosystems are Upending Life with Malin Pinsky
The Great Simplification with Nate Hagens
Nate Hagens
4.8 • 550 Ratings
🗓️ 28 May 2025
⏱️ 65 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
For all of human history, the oceans and the life within them have remained a stable and fundamental part of Earth as we know it. Yet, for the past few decades, fisheries and scientists alike have observed massive migrations in marine ecosystems unlike anything we've ever witnessed. What is driving these unprecedented movements, and how are they rippling out to affect every aspect of life
In this conversation, Nate is joined by marine ecologist Malin Pinsky, whose decades of research shed light on the dramatic migrations of marine species due to rising ocean temperatures. Malin breaks down the science behind these changes – from declining oxygen levels pushing fish toward the poles, to the cascading impacts on intricate marine food webs, as well as the growing threat of localized extinctions among key fishery species.
How has a cultural disconnect from the importance of biodiversity and the interdependence of life led to such a drastic impact on the function of our oceans? What do these changes mean for humanity, including impacts on global food security and geopolitical stability? Finally, could reconnecting with the ocean's abundant, diverse ecosystems help us reduce our impact on these deep, blue pillars of life?
(Conversation recorded on April 22nd, 2025)
About Malin Pinsky:
Malin Pinsky is an Associate Professor in the Department of Ecology & Evolutionary Biology at the University of California Santa Cruz with expertise in the adaptation of ocean life to climate change and applications to ocean conservation and fisheries. His more than 120 publications have appeared in Science, Nature, and other journals.
He is a Fellow of the American Association for the Advancement of Science, an Earth Leadership Fellow, and an Early Career Fellow of the Ecological Society of America. Pinsky serves on advisory boards for the Beijer Institute of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences, the non-profit Oceana, and the Chewonki Foundation. He grew up exploring tidepools and mountains in Maine.
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | what we're seeing is probably the largest mass movement of marine life in the last 10,000 years. |
| 0:08.0 | As waters are warming, as prey are shifting towards the poles, as oxygen levels in the ocean are going down. |
| 0:15.6 | All of these things are making conditions inhospitable for many of the species, especially fish and the ocean. |
| 0:22.2 | And then this has ripple effects that go through to coastal economies and fisheries, |
| 0:28.2 | even international relations. |
| 0:29.8 | It's sparking conflict in some cases between countries. |
| 0:32.6 | So it has wide-reaching consequences. |
| 0:38.6 | You're listening to the Great Simplification. |
| 0:42.0 | I'm Nate Higgins. |
| 0:43.1 | On this show, we describe how energy, the economy, the environment, and human behavior all |
| 0:48.6 | fit together and what it might mean for our future. |
| 0:52.2 | By sharing insights from global thinkers, we hope to inform and inspire more humans to play |
| 0:58.0 | emergent roles in the coming great simplification. |
| 1:06.8 | Today I'm joined by marine biologist Malin Pinsky to discuss what he describes as possibly one of the |
| 1:14.3 | largest animal migrations in our planet's history occurring right now in Earth's oceans. |
| 1:21.6 | Malin is an associate professor in the Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology at the University of |
| 1:27.3 | California Santa Cruz, |
| 1:29.1 | where he has been using decades of data to research the changes and adaptations in ocean life |
| 1:34.4 | due to climate change. He is also a fellow of the American Association for the Advancement of |
| 1:39.8 | Science, an Earth Leadership Fellow, and an early career fellow of the Ecological Society of America. |
| 1:46.7 | Most notably, Malin and his team have been studying the poleward shift in animal populations |
| 1:52.7 | due to both rising temperatures and insufficient oxygen levels, which is the subject of today's |
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