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Hello and welcome to another episode of the Adlots podcast. I'm Joe Weisenthal.

And I'm Tracy Alloway. Tracy, do you remember the conversation that we recently had with Doug

Sifu, the Vertu CEO? Yeah, that was a great conversation. That's funny.

Yeah, now that was a really fun one. Obviously, that was a discussion about high-frequency

trading, electronic market making and listed equities. And when striking is ultimately,

I mean, these are like profitable businesses, but you know, they are in that business just scraping

for pennies or fractions of a pennies. These are pretty efficient markets. It's hard to

ring more profit out of them. It's definitely a volume business. You're making a penny on the trade

from a tiny, tiny, difficult to see spread. There's so many different players in this,

everyone's trying to get there margin. I've said it before, U.S. listed equities and

particular and probably elsewhere too. It's like, they're pretty efficient market.

Yeah, I think that's right. I mean, I think, well, we also just had an episode on the U.S.

Treasury market. And I think you'd probably say stocks and maybe U.S.

Treasuries are the most liquid markets out there. Corporate bonds, not so liquid. We've talked

a lot about that on the show. So one thing we haven't actually talked about, I realize, is we've

done a few episodes about crypto and Bitcoin, but we've never really talked about market

...