The England Fly-Half Debate

The Good, The Bad & The Rugby

Folding Pocket

Sports News, Sports, Rugby, News

4.5 • 2.5K Ratings

🗓️ 21 October 2025

⏱️ 76 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

The first major peak of the season is nearly here with the Autumn Nations Series, and the new England squad announcement has delivered two massive headlines: the departure of Tom Willis to France, and the inclusion of teenage try-scoring sensation Noah Caluorie. But the real debate is at fly-half. From Andrew & Barnes, Wilkinson and his challengers, Farrell to Ford, the England number ten jersey has always been a national talking point. Now, with George Ford, Fin Smith, and Marcus Smith all vying for the starting spot, who will Steve Borthwick hand the keys to ahead of the next World Cup cycle? Joining Payno this week are two men who know the pressure cooker of fly-half selection better than anyone: former England 10s and World Cup stars Charlie Hodgson (38 caps, Premiership's all-time top scorer) and Toby Flood (60 caps, 2011 Six Nations winner). Season 6 is Sponsored by Continental Tyres 00:00 🎙️ Introduction 03:18 🏉 Charlie and Toby’s Rugby Careers 13:42 💪 Continental Tyres Grip Strength Challenge 15:40 🌹 Discussion on the new England Squad 16:50 🌟 Noah Caluori: Rising Star 22:07 🤔 Debate on England's Fly Half Selection 31:48 🎯 Owen Farrell's Future 49:25 🔄 Debating England's Centre Combinations 55:53 🌍 The Fly-Half Debate in Global Context 01:04:16 🇫🇷 Tom Willis' Move to Bordeaux 🎟️ Tour Tickets: ⁠https://myticket.co.uk/artists/the-good-the-bad-the-rugby 🥃 Rémy Martin x Barbarians Live Show: ⁠https://www.eventbrite.com/e/a-night-with-barbarian-legends-x-remy-martin-vsop-tickets-1777685728869 🍀O’Neill’s Live Show : https://www.eventbrite.com/e/gbr-x-oneills-autumn-nations-show-england-v-all-blacks-preview-tickets-1691405211519?aff=erelexpmlt 📘 GBR Book: ⁠https://www.waterstones.com/book/reloaded-the-good-the-bad-and-the-rugby/james-haskell/mike-tindall/9780008786373 🏉 Rugby Buddy: https://www.rugby-buddy.com ⁠#rugby⁠ ⁠#podcast⁠ ⁠#tindall⁠ ⁠#haskell⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	I always really respected Charlie. He was someone I watched and in my growing up and then suddenly
0:03.8	I got the chance to sort of knocks me out. Yeah. Thanks about the England scene. Thanks, thank you. You have got great understanding of what it is like to be given that 10 shirt and to try and control the hype, the emotion, the national expectation, a journey to a rugby world cup. Finn was the one that was in charge of that shirt and in theory should still be in charge of the shirt because he's gone in the Lions store for the So it's just weird paradox of being selected at George,
0:23.9	going on a lion's trip and then suddenly coming back being behind george if you ask owen he's never going to give up that dream of playing for england no he's not that sort of personality and character to just to lie down johnny's fault that's what it is just blame john. You got that tattooed somewhere, but I'm just blame Johnny.
0:40.3	Alex Payne trying to keep the side going forward.
0:43.0	Haskell takes it on now with just relentless chat.
0:45.8	And there's Tyndall to add the finishing touch of glamour
0:48.0	and World Cup winning stories,
0:50.1	a dominant display by the good, the bad and the rugby.
0:54.4	Hello, Dream Team.
0:55.4	I hope you are well.
0:56.5	The first big peak of the season is fast arriving with the Autumn Nation series now on the horizon.
1:01.7	And on Sunday evening, England announced a squad with two big headlines.
1:05.6	First of all, no Tom Willis following the news that he has returned to France
1:09.2	and the inclusion of 6'5 19-year-old
1:12.6	winger, tri-scoring sensation Noah Kallori. England certainly have incredible depth in certain
1:18.3	positions, fly half being one of them, and one question immediately stands out. Who will wear
1:23.6	the England number 10 jersey this autumn? It is a question England fans have long debated,
1:28.4	and I think long love debating. From Andrew V Barnes through Wilkinson and his challenges,
1:33.6	we have the Cypriani debate, we have Farrell and Ford, and we have Farrell or Ford, and now
1:38.5	Ford, Marcus Smith, Finn Smith, and Stil Owen Farrell. Where, why and how will Steve Borthwick make his decision,
1:45.3	perhaps the biggest of his England tenure,
1:47.5	given we're now just two years away from the next World Cup?
	...

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