This is the Cato Daily Podcast for Friday, October 13th, 2017.

I'm Keelib Brown, when Foundation for Individual Rights and Education President Greg

Lucianov confidently predicted things were getting better with respect to freedom of

speech on college campuses it was, and he was very wrong.

We spoke today about where campus speech has gone in just a few years.

You wrote a book several years ago called Unlearning Liberty, and it's now five years since that book came out and

it seems like things have gotten much much much worse since you wrote that.

So I've been with fire since 2001 when we're only about a year and a half old and I've learned the hard way that if you as soon as you're inclined to say that the situation for free speech and due process and academic freedom on campus is getting better, it's probably just

about to get much worse.

I thought this in around 2006 and then 2007 was the worst year I'd ever seen.

And I thought this when my first book on learning

liberty came out in 2012, that things were actually improving. I even added a

chapter kind of at the last minute called Don't Object to Authority, basically Listen to Authority because we were reverting to cases

that were pretty much standard, don't you dare criticize this school, which in some ways it might not sound like progress,

but it's such a typical sort of classic kind of censorship.

It was like, okay, we're moving a little bit further away from ideological censorship

and more to the kind of things you could expect to see in any corporation, for example.

And that was 2012, so in 2012 it felt like things were getting at least a little bit better.

And then 2013, 2014 came along and things got a lot worse.

And what got a lot worse, which was heartbreaking for those of fire who really enjoy defending

students, was that the students themselves started demanding people be

disinvited sometimes from commencement speeches a lot of times not if they were

...