The Complicated Legacy of F W de Klerk

Dan Snow's History Hit

History Hit

History

4.7 • 12.9K Ratings

🗓️ 28 November 2021

⏱️ 28 minutes

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Summary

The result of his complicated legacy, the death of South Africa's last apartheid president, F W de Klerk, on November 11 2021 generated a flood of differing assessments. De Klerk wrote himself into the history of South Africa on February 2 1990, when he announced the unbanning of the African National Party (ANC) and other liberation movements, as well as the release of Nelson Mandela from prison. While this set South Africa on the path of reform, De Klerk’s failure to break free of apartheid thinking was evident throughout the years that would follow.

To arrive at a rounded, fact-based understanding of De Klerk’s place in history, Dan is joined by “Mac” Maharaj. Mac has been involved in the freedom struggle since 1952. After serving a twelve-year sentence on Robben Island from 1965-1976, he was appointed secretary of the department charged with organising the ANC within South Africa. Mac served alongside De Klerk in the first democratic cabinet, led by Mandela. As joint secretary of the Multi-Party Negotiating Forum and the Transitional Executive Council, Mac was directly involved in the negotiations that produced the transition from apartheid to democracy.

Mac is the co-author of the upcoming Breakthrough: The Struggles and Secret Talks that Brought Apartheid SA to the Negotiating Table

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Transcript

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0:00.0	I'm very welcome to Dan Snow's History Hit. On the 11th of November 2021, Frederick
0:07.6	Willem DeClure, F. W. DeClure, the last white president of South Africa, died in Cape Town.
0:16.3	He won the Nobel Peace Prize for his part in the process of transition from white apartheid
0:21.1	rule, minority rule, to majority rule, democracy in South Africa. He then served under Nelson
0:29.0	Mandela as deputy president from 1994 to 1996. How should we think about this man? How should
0:36.8	we think about a career that saw him presiding over white supremacist state, but also one that
0:41.5	involved eventually talking to, compromising with, his former enemies and putting South Africa
0:47.4	on the path to democracy? I was very, very lucky in this podcast. I got to talk to a legend
0:53.1	of the Freedom Struggle, Mac Maharaj. He was in prison alongside Nelson Mandela on Robin
0:59.3	Island. He was involved in secret negotiations with F. W. DeClure's team in the 1980s,
1:05.6	in the 1990s. And that's an experience he's written a book about, breaks through the struggles
1:11.0	and secret talks that brought apartheid South Africa to the negotiating table. It's a
1:16.9	real, real pleasure to talk to Mac. He's as fascinating about the past as he is about
1:21.3	the present and future as you'll hear. I really enjoyed this. I hope you will too.
1:26.6	If you enjoy listening to his podcast, you might want to check us out. If you want to
1:30.1	listen to it without, yeah, it's not going to understand why lots of ads are at the
1:32.6	moment. You can go to history hit TV where we've got TV channel. We've got hundreds
1:36.3	documentaries on there. We've got thousands of podcasts. It's all that. He's going to
1:39.7	history hit.tv. And because it is Black Friday, you use the code Black Friday, in which
1:44.7	case you ruin me. I'm in penu. I'm working for nothing here, guys. But it's worth it
1:49.0	for the Black Friday tradition. This ancient tradition stemming from just a couple of years
1:53.3	ago of people going mad on this weekend every year. Black Friday, all one word, gets you
	...

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