Gide, humans.

Welcome to the safe space for dangerous ideas.

And let's be honest, however uncomfortable we say that we find conversations around climate chaos and renewables and nuclear and the future of the planet. The reality is that in general those conversations

are taking place within a fairly comfortable elite consensus that says that the problem is

there's too much carbon in the air. We have to stop producing so much carbon. We have to stop

emitting it. The correct way to figure out how to do that is through international institutions

like the United Nations. We have to electrify everything and embrace renewable energy. All well and good. There has always

been a subset of cranks who want to have more uncomfortable conversations about this, about the

possibility of geoengineering the planet so that we can mitigate the worst effects of climate chaos,

whether or not we are reducing carbon emissions.

There's carbon capture and storage.

There's a whole bunch of hairbrain ideas.

And I usually don't want to give huge credence to anything that smells of denying the underlying

problem.

Today's guest does not do that. He's a fascinating

individual. His name is Kiko Toro. He's the director of climate repair for the Anthropocene Institute.

And he has an idea, an idea that could revolutionize the way that we think about climate change.

Kiko joined me on a substack live from where he lives in Tokyo. He's formerly a journalist by training. He's written for

foreign affairs and the Atlantic. He wrote the Latitudes column in the New York Times,

and he was a global opinion columnist for The Washington Post. He's now a contributing editor

for Persuasion. He is from

Venezuela, so I spend the first five or ten minutes of this conversation just picking his mind

...