The “Catch More Flies with Shugerman” Edition

Rational Security

The Lawfare Institute

Foreignpolicy, Nationalsecurity, News, Government, Politics, Middleeast

4.8 • 2K Ratings

🗓️ 20 April 2023

⏱️ 63 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

This week, Alan, Quinta, and Scott were joined by law professor extraordinaire Jed Shugerman to talk over his controversial take on the New York district attorney's case against former President Trump, among other items in the week's national security news, including:

“If You Come at the King, You Best Not Whiff.” Former President Trump’s indictment on 34 counts of falsifying business records in the first degree under New York state law earlier this month has triggered a firestorm of controversy, with several commentators accusing New York district attorney Alvin Bragg of advancing a weak or flawed case. What should we make of Bragg’s case based on what we know so far? And what more information should we be looking for?
“Factual Malice.” Fox News has settled the defamation lawsuit being pursued against it by Dominion Voting Systems for a record $787.5 million—but without having to make an on-air acknowledgement of its false statements. Does this settlement deal do justice? Should Dominion have proceeded differently?
“Secret Chinese Agents, Huh?” Federal prosecutors have arrested two individuals in Brooklyn for operating a “secret police station” on behalf of the People’s Republic of China’s internal security forces, aimed at investigating and intimidating dissidents and other disfavored individuals. How should the United States and other governments approach these China-backed presences? Is criminal prosecution the right tool?

For object lessons, Jed recommended "The Only Woman in the Room," a new biography of Israeli prime minister Golda Meir by his colleague Pnina Lahav. Quinta rolled logs for her latest piece on the Dominion settlement with Fox News in Lawfare. Alan highlighted the fact that Stormy Daniels has received a lifetime achievement award from PornHub—a publication Alan insists he reads for the articles—as well as the fantastic new Apple movie "Sharper." And Scott gave his strongest recommendation for season 2 of the phenomenal BBC podcast "The Lazarus Heist," which digs even deeper into the crimes of (and context surrounding) the North Korea-backed hacker ring, The Lazarus Group.

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Transcript

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0:00.0	So, Jed, I'm really curious. What was it like when Isaac Chotner called? Did your
0:06.1	life flash before your eyes? Were you terrified? I mean, you survived that interview.
0:11.6	I'm impressed. What I literally, I got a DM from him and I DM it back.
0:18.4	LOL. I'm a big fan, but I'm not going to be the next blank. Fill in the blank of
0:24.2	your favorite law professor who didn't come away with reputation and
0:31.1	tack from a Chotner interview. But I also had another friend who had an interview
0:35.8	with him and it went much smoother for this friend, so that was, he does great work.
0:42.6	I will say, I think I've talked to Isaac twice for these interviews and I'm still
0:47.8	employed. So, the Chotner rule is not 100%. A few of us escape unscathed.
0:53.9	You need spicier takes, Quinta. I mean, I guess, apparently. I'm never, I am never picking up
0:59.9	the phone. He's a big fan. He's a very nice guy. I've stayed in my contacts just to avoid him
1:04.9	for that purpose. All my ex-girlfriends. Do not hang up. Do not hang up.
1:08.4	Isaac, we're all, if you're listening, we're all enormous fans of you and you go straight
1:12.7	to voicemail. Well, it was fun. He was, he asked, in truth, he asked the questions that I was
1:20.4	getting in much more aggressive ways from both anonymous accounts on Twitter and people we know
1:27.8	and love and respect. And it was actually quite a good opportunity to address those questions.
1:34.2	Chad, do you, do you enjoy your new, your new status as a hard-right, mega conservative?
1:41.2	You're not, you're not wearing the hat. Which seems like a mistake on your heart.
1:44.6	Which I should also say as someone who literally co-authored a piece about why tell Trump should
1:48.6	go to jail for January 6th, I do find fairly endlessly amusing reading your Twitter replies.
1:56.6	You should see, I did gain some followers who I expect will also unfollow me pretty soon as I
2:05.8	as I explain where I think the case is much stronger and much more important for those
	...

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