The following podcast contains explicit language. Welcome to the Slate Audio Book Club's discussion of Department of Speculation by Jenny Othol. I'm Dan Cois. I'm the editor of the Slate Book Review, and I'm here in Slate's New York recording studio on a trip up to New York. Joining me here is Jessica Winter, who's a Slate Senior editor. Hi, Jessica. Hey, I'm Don. And also joining us is Megan Rourke, a Slate Culture Critic. Hey, Megan.

Hey.

As with all audiobook clubs, if you are a person who cares about spoilers, listen after because, like, read the book and then listen to us because we will be spoiling. although, as is often the case, it seems like the secrets of this novel are not so secret,

and the magic or lack thereof, depending on your take on it, is in the case. It seems like the secrets of this novel are not so secret, and the

magic or lack thereof, depending on your take on it, is in the details. Department of Speculation

is a, I sort of ended up thinking of it as a rock hard little fragment of a novel. It is about the

journey of a marriage and the difficulties that that journey encounters.

And it's also about the struggle to make art in the face of the travails of life.

When I read it, I really, really wanted to talk about it with people. And I think a lot of people had that same response.

In fact, during last month's podcast when I said, oh, this is the novel that we're doing,

Megan, said, oh, I just read that and I really want to talk about it.

But now that we are here talking about it, it's also sort of hard to figure out exactly where to start because it's a novel that invites a lot of thinking, but is also a little bit resistant to interpretation, at least for me.

But so I do know that some of the things we'll talk about today are about the book's structure,

which is a little bit odd, about the narrator's difficult balancing of family love

and the desire to make things, to make art to write about the betrayal that transforms the novel,

which is the sort of the big point at which the novel turns from a plot standpoint.

And also I want to talk a little bit about the sort of ginger way that the book explores something approaching mental illness, although I wouldn't quite exactly put it that way.

But we'll also hit lots of other topics, but let's definitely start with the structure, which I think is maybe the easiest way into explaining what this book really is. It's made up of numerous short fragments. I don't think any of them

are longer than a page. The book itself is very small, about 180, 190 pages. Most of these fragments

are just a couple of sentences at most. They make a narrative. It is a narrative that you can follow, but that narrative is frequently interrupted.

I mean, like on every page, it's interrupted by notes or observations or sort of little

stand-up comedy riffs or whatever.

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