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The problem with cultural differences isn't a bogeyman.

There's case after case after case.

The public are clearly not willing to put up with just the sort of airy platitudes.

They want to have a serious conversation about controlling the border. When things clash as it did between Beth Upton and Sandy Peggy, it's very obvious who holds the power in that dynamic. It's not all be kind. It's very much be kind or else. It just never stops. It's not purely going to be when the police turn up, that you're going to feel that chilling effect, that demonisation, that ostracisation, purely for expressing perfectly legitimate view.

Hello and welcome to the Spike podcast. I'm Fraser Myers. Delighted to be joined as ever by Spike's editor Tom Slater.

Hello.

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