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death panel underscore i'm beatrice hadler bolton and i'm joined today by returning guest and dear friend

of the panel dean spade to talk about the new and updated second edition of dean's book mutual aid

which just came out from versa so dean has spent decades working to build queer and trans liberation

grounded in racial and economic justice.

He's a longtime organizer who by day works as a law professor and you might know him from his work in the early 2000s with the Sylvia Rivera Law Project or his 2015 documentary on pinkwashing or numerous other projects.

Dean is also the author of the book's Normal Life, Administrative

Violence, Critical Trans Politics, and the Limits of the Law, Mutual Aid, Building Solidarity

During This Crisis and the Next, and Love in a Fucked Up World, How to Build Relationships,

Hook Up and Raise Hell Together, which is also the same title of a podcast that Dean now hosts.

Dean, welcome back to the death panel. Thank you. I'm so

glad to be with you. I'm excited to talk about this today because it's a chance for us actually to

return at the first thing we ever talked about together, which is this book, or I guess more

accurately, like, which was a conversation about how we actually do the messy work of surviving

together collectively, you know, survival in the

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